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European Salon de News, Discussion et Klatsch - 20 September

by dvx Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:17:46 PM EST

 A Daily Review Of International Online Media 


Europeans on this date in history:

The Indian Rebellion of 1857 ends with the recapture of Delhi by troops loyal to the East India Company.

More here and here

 The European Salon is a daily selection of news items to which you are invited to contribute. Post links to news stories that interest you, or just your comments. Come in and join us!


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 EUROPE 



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:19:08 PM EST
German authorities launch neo-Nazi database | News | DW.DE | 19.09.2012

The German Interior Ministry has officially launched a national database with information on suspected neo-Nazi extremists. It is meant to improve cooperation between security agencies and prevent right-wing attacks.

The new database links the findings of 36 German police and intelligence agencies on the federal and state level with information about violent right-wing extremists and their contacts.

Authorities hope this information will help prevent serious margins of error as seen in the case of the neo-Nazi terror cell, the National Socialist Underground (NSU).

Interior Minister Hans-Peter Friedrich described the new database as "a milestone in improving the cooperation between German security agencies.

"I believe that this is the correct course of action in light of the NSU murders, because the impression we gain is that at some point or another communication between the authorities was in need of improvement," he said.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:38:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
USAid covertly influencing political processes, says Russia | World news | guardian.co.uk

Russia has accused the US of using its aid agency in Moscow to covertly influence the country's politics and elections, explaining its decision to expel the mission amid a wider crackdown on the opposition movement.

The Russian government has given the US agency for international development (USAid) until 1 October to cease all operations in the country. The agency helps fund a number of pro-democracy and human rights groups that have provoked the Kremlin's wrath amid an unprecedented opposition movement against the Russian president, Vladimir Putin.

In an uncharacteristically blunt statement, the Russian foreign ministry said that the decision to shut USAid was taken primarily because the agency's work "does not always correspond to [its] stated goals".

"This means attempts to exert influence, via the distribution of grants, upon political processes, including elections of various levels and institutions of civil society," it said.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:38:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Of course aid is meant to influence, what do they think it is ? Charity ??

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:24:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Paris magazine's Muhammad cartoons prompt fears for French embassies | World news | guardian.co.uk

Security at French embassies around the world has been reinforced after the Paris-based satirical magazine Charlie Hebdo published cartoons mocking the prophet Muhammad.

Amid continuing protests by Muslims around the globe over a controversial anti-Islam film, French ministers and religious leaders called for restraint, and riot police were posted outside the magazine's offices.

French embassies and schools in 20 countries will be temporarily closed on Friday, as a precautionary measure in case of fresh protests after prayers, the foreign ministry said.

The offices of Charlie Hebdo were firebombed last November after it published an edition entitled Charia Hebdo, supposedly guest-edited by Muhammad.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:39:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If enough countries do this sort of thing, maybe we can get some real trouble started. Or, maybe the whole "I'm offended, therefore I will kill you" think will fall out of fashion.

(Except in the U.S., where it's modified to "I feel threatened, therefore I will kill you.")

by asdf on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 05:54:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It needs to happen more often rather than on a large scale.

Huge outrage twice a year? Let's pack a picnic basket.
Slight weekly outrage? Meh.

(Which is how a lot of social change is affected - in whatever direction.)


-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:06:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
What I'd like to know is what they thought they'd achieve by printing it.

I follow the point that, in our culture, these things are harmless. But right now, when the West has decided that it has the right to stir up and bomb the Middle East as and when "we" feel like it, we shouldn't be surprised if there isn't a little pushback when we express contempt for the values of the people we're stirring up.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:27:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]
What I'd like to know is what they thought they'd achieve by printing it.

Sell more copies?

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:53:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Charlie Hebdo is a satirical magazine that comments on what's happening in the world. For my money, about 50% of the cartoons in any given issue are funny, but ymmv, of course.

The question is, why would they not publish cartoons on the theme of the "Muhammed film" this week? Charlie is not famous for its editorial restraint or discretion, a.k.a. self-censorship.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 04:27:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes, but satire implies a power relationship of the weak lampooning the foibles of the powerful.

thus, attacking the clergy when the church is rich and powerful, as the catholic church remains, is a worthwhile endeavor. It remains debatable, from the viewpoint of the average muslim, whether this power relationship is quite the same when attacking islam in a newspaper read by white middle class europeans published in a Western Capital.

If you fail to understand the concept of privilege, then you don't understand satire

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:17:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Maybe they could draw something as well.

Or we could quote Rodney King again.

Meh. Won't work. Let's wait 50 years for gradual change.

-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 08:06:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Millions could draw, and the only thing newsworthy would still be if someone called in a bomb treath.

Or you know, millions could use economic power and boycott, only to see a re-print followed by violence, the violence in retrospect justifying the re-print. Like them Danish cartoons (boycott: autumn 2005, re-print early January 2006, violence from February 2006 and onwards).

A vote for PES is a vote for EPP! A vote for EPP is a vote for PES! Support the coalition, vote EPP-PES in 2009!

by A swedish kind of death on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 08:30:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yeah, that's the appeal of terrorism: it works.


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sapere aude
by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:20:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Radical islam, and in particular its wahabi avatar, is a very powerful force indeed. The individual muslim who may riot or attack French interests around the world will never see the cartoons in question, they are being manipulated for political ends by the wahabis or their surrogates. They have been told that it is islam which is being attacked -- and guess what, you have bought their argument.

By the same token, I suppose you would have been against satirising fascism in the 1930s? That would be an interesting debate.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 08:29:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Radical Islam is a powerful force ?? It depends how you define radical or powerful. There are so many strains of it and to believe that even those who claim to radicalism are remotely in agreement with each other is a serious stretch.

What most muslims around the world will agree upon is that the home ground of Islam, the Middle East, has been used as a playpen by The West (however defined) for decades, and none of that interference has been for the benefit of the people in that region. Democracies have been overthrown, dictatorships installed and cosseted, valuable mineral wealth extracted and, again, no benefit has come from it for the people of the region.

They even know that, should a group of westerners decide they want their land, as happened in Palestine, they will be displaced and there is little they can do about it. In fact, if they try to resist, they and their families will be killed without remorse and called terrorists for defending themselves.

So when, at last, they are told that their very religion, the only thing that binds them together, is being pilloried and vilified by the very smug westerners whom they consider are ruining their lives, it should be no surprise that they believe it without question. Because it is easy to believe it when they see similar with their very eyes every day.

 Do they consider themselves powerful ? Of course not, because if they did they know the West would not casually insult something they consider so important.

Now you can play comparative victimisation all you like and say how terrible it is that we in the freedom loving west can't carry on pissing all over these people as we like. That it is important that we can piss over them. That they are free to piss over us if they like. But they don't see it like that.

Maybe, when there comes a time when we don't feel free to invade their countries, protect their tyrants and frustrate their democratic development, when we listen to them with the respect owing to fellow human beings, then maybe we can enter into a discussion about satirical representation. But till the, we have to accept they don't accept our liberalism because they see it as just another weapon to be used against them.

In the privilege game, we got it, they don't and satirising their behaviour and telling them off for being annoyed about it is morally equivalent to denigrating all Africans as having big red lips and coming from bongo-bongo land

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:21:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]

The Onion, September 13,  ISSUE 48.37: No One Murdered Because Of This Image

Following the publication of the image above, in which the most cherished figures from multiple religious faiths were depicted engaging in a lascivious sex act of considerable depravity, no one was murdered, beaten, or had their lives threatened, sources reported Thursday.

I won't include a clickable link in case someone is at work. NSWF or just silly depending on who you are. Refuge in Audacity I think.


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sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:03:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Manchester police shootings: second man arrested | UK news | guardian.co.uk

A second man has been arrested in connection with the deaths of two unarmed police officers in a grenade and gun attack.

Greater Manchester Chief Constable Sir Peter Fahy said a 28-year-old man was detained in Hattersley on suspicion of conspiracy to murder.

Dale Cregan, 29, is also being questioned over the officers' deaths and the killings of father and son David and Mark Short.

The home secretary, Theresa May, flew into Manchester earlier on Wednesday as the family of one of the two unarmed police officers killed in an apparent ambush spoke of their loss.

May broke short her holiday to join Fahy in the city as the investigation into the double murder of the officers Nicola Hughes, 23, and Fiona Bone, 32, continued.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:39:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
EU, Iran agree to hold new round of nuclear talks - Xinhua | English.news.cn

ISTANBUL, Sept. 19 (Xinhua) -- Iran's chief nuclear negotiator Saeed Jalili said here Wednesday that Iran and the European Union (EU) have agreed to hold a new round of nuclear talks in the near future.

Jalili made the statement at a press conference after he had talks with EU foreign affairs representative Catherine Ashton in Istanbul on Tuesday.

The Iranian official said the time for the upcoming nuclear talks will be decided when Ashton goes back and submit report to the P5+1 -- the five permanent members of the UN Security Council plus Germany.

An Iranian diplomat told Xinhua that it would take at least one month to start the new round of nuclear talks.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:37:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Young people should busk if they can't afford train fare, says Tory MP

Damian Collins MP. Education: Oxford, St Benet's Hall  - "the only constituent body of the University admitting men alone". (For the past century and until this year, the Master has always been an actual Benedictine. Neat!)

Plus ca change ... except for the "change" part.

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sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 04:54:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Not sure what I intended the subject to be, but it wasn't "Not n" ... Sorry about that.  

Curse these complicated computing machines that I use 12 hours a day.


-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:21:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Young people should busk if they can't afford train fare, says Tory MP | Metro.co.uk

Collins said young people who stay at school to do A-levels often `aren't employable'.

Experience is more important than education he pointed out while a lack of `motivation' may be holding back many he suggested.

Well, Collins was able to go beyond A-levels and still get himself a job. Whether he's qualified for it is another matter. Benet's is a tiny private Catholic hall affiliated to the university -- not so long ago its members were all Benedictines. But Collins prepared his future in a better way: he was president of the university's Conservative Association, a well-known stepping-stone to a political career.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:56:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
In other words, there's busking and busking.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:59:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Indeed. I'm guessing his definition includes The Oxford Revue and Footlights.

"I like punting on the River,
I like strawberries in the sun."
(Radio Active, "Edinburgh Festival")


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sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:04:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It's not what you know, it's what you know about whom.

-----
sapere aude
by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:04:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I wonder if he read Faust?
by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 07:55:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
well they could start by making things easier for buskers, some special rain shelters, some services for the listeners.

hammocks and lemonade come to mind...

there's a nice whiff of the New Deal about it, certainly unintentional!

It's a fine line between homage, parody, and consumer opportunism. Jess Walter

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:48:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Eurointelligence Daily Morning Newsbriefing: A looming showdown between Spain and Catalonia (20.09.2012)
Mariano Rajoy will meet with Catalan leader Artur Mas to discuss Catalan demands for autonomy over tax policy; Mas may announce early elections for November ahead of the meeting, according to one press report - something Rajoy does not want to happen; Rajoy opposes autonomy but may be open to a compromise, and has warned the Catalans that he will not accept any attempt of a secession; the King posts an open letter in defence of Spanish unity - which went down like a lead balloon in Catalonia; Catalonia's economy minister Andreu Mas-Collel says Catalonia's businesses would be better off if Catalonia had the instruments of a state; he blames the lack of liquidity on the lack of a fiscal authority; Christian Noyer says the OMT may not need to be in place for a long, as it already has an effect even if it is never used; coalition MPs in the Bundestag are ready to sabotage banking union, with a proposal that leaves all powers in the member states; the French prime minister cools down expectations of a turnaround in unemployment as promised by Francois Hollande during the election campaign; the Greek coalition is moving to a High Noon moment to agree a package of cuts demanded by the troika; Moody's says one in five Irish mortgages will end up defaulting; the Netherlands, too, has to tackle a hidden, but massive mortgage crisis; Portugal's Social Democratic want to mend relations with small their coalition partner; James Mackintosh says a sense of normality has returned to Europe's money and capital markets; the crisis has reinforced the trend among Italians to live with their mothers; Italian parties are now facing the prospect of subjecting their party accounts to an external audit; Silvio Berlusconi's party is most opposed to this measure; FT Alphaville has dug up a Merrill Lynch report warning about how the rise in the euro is self-defeating; Anatole Kaletsky says QE3 and OMT mark the official end of the monetarist era; Richard Koo, meanwhile, is less impressed, and says none of this can end a balance-sheet recession.


I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:23:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Anatole Kaletsky: Central banks make an historic turn (Reuters blogs, September 19, 2012)
... we must go back in history 40 years, to the early 1970s. Maintaining full employment was at that time regarded as the main objective of all economic policy, and this had been the case for roughly 40 years, since the Great Depression. But by the early 1970s, voters had enjoyed decades of more or less full employment and were starting to focus on inflation rather than depression as the main threat to their prosperity. Economists and politicians were responding to this shift. Milton Friedman led a monetarist "counterrevolution" against the Keynesian obsession with unemployment, designing new economic models to challenge the Keynesian view that market economies were naturally prone to long-term stagnation. By restoring the pre-Keynesian assumption that market economies were automatically self-stabilizing, the monetarist models produced two powerful policy prescriptions directly opposed to the Keynesian views.

First, the monetarists insisted that price stability, rather than full employment, was the only legitimate target for monetary policy and government macroeconomic management more generally. Second, they argued that central bankers should not accept any direct responsibility for unemployment, since sustainable job creation depended solely on private enterprise - full employment would be achieved automatically if inflation were conquered and market forces were allowed to operate freely, with the minimum of government interference or union constraints. A few years later, Margaret Thatcher and Ronald Reagan turned Friedman's intellectual revolution into practical politics. On top of its economic impact, monetarism had huge ideological effects by absolving government macroeconomic management of any direct responsibility for jobs and instead attributing unemployment to regulations, unions, welfare policies and other market distortions.

The historic significance of this month's central bank decisions should now be clear. The Fed has promised to keep printing money until full employment is restored - and it has committed itself to even bolder measures if those announced last week prove inadequate. The ECB has undertaken to "do whatever it takes" to preserve the euro and specifically to buy Spanish and Italian government bonds with newly created euros in unlimited amounts.




I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 08:49:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]
 ECONOMY & FINANCE 


The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:19:24 PM EST
Deposit Flight From Europe Banks Eroding Common Currency - Bloomberg

An accelerating flight of deposits from banks in four European countries is jeopardizing the renewal of economic growth and undermining a main tenet of the common currency: an integrated financial system.

A total of 326 billion euros ($425 billion) was pulled from banks in Spain, Portugal, Ireland and Greece in the 12 months ended July 31, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. The plight of Irish and Greek lenders, which were bleeding cash in 2010, spread to Spain and Portugal last year.

The flight of deposits from the four countries coincides with an increase of about 300 billion euros at lenders in seven nations considered the core of the euro zone, including Germany and France, almost matching the outflow. That's leading to a fragmentation of credit and a two-tiered banking system blocking economic recovery and blunting European Central Bank policy in the third year of a sovereign-debt crisis.

"Capital flight is leading to the disintegration of the euro zone and divergence between the periphery and the core," said Alberto Gallo, the London-based head of European credit research at Royal Bank of Scotland Group Plc. "Companies pay 1 to 2 percentage points more to borrow in the periphery. You can't get growth to resume with such divergence."



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:45:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ruble Extends Third Day of Losses on Falling Crude Oil Prices - Bloomberg

The ruble weakened for a third day, as crude oil, Russia's main export earner, fell and investors began to close long positions on the currency.

The ruble depreciated 0.8 percent to 31.2125 as of 7 p.m. in Moscow. It lost 0.8 percent against the euro and the central bank's target euro-dollar basket to 40.4650 and 35.5043, respectively.

The Russian currency strengthened as much as 0.5 percent in intraday trading as oil advanced on bets Japan's expanded program of monetary easing will bolster fuel demand. Oil slid more than 3 percent to $92.36 per barrel in New York following a U.S. Energy Department report that showed inventories surged the most since March and on speculation Saudi Arabia is taking action to reduce oil prices. Oil and gas contribute about 50 percent of Russia's state revenue.

"The drop in oil prices is significant and the ruble is naturally taking a cue from the oil price movements," Ivan Tchakarov, chief economist at Moscow-based Renaissance Capital. Market players continue to "lock in profits on the back of the very fast ruble appreciation we had seen recently on the back of Fed's QE3," he said.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:45:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Latvia still keen to join single currency despite euro crisis | World news | guardian.co.uk

Perverse as it may seem, all the talk in the eurozone is not only of shrinkage. Greece's single currency days may be numbered. The jury is out on Portugal. The main narrative is of a leaner and meaner currency area emerging from the crisis.

But if Latvia has its way, the eurozone will have grown to 18 members within 18 months.

From boom to bust to booming again in the space of five years, Latvia is knocking on the doors in Brussels and Frankfurt asking to come in.

"We don't think it's a sinking ship. We still see more positives than negatives," Valdis Dombrovskis, the Latvian prime minister, told the Guardian in an interview.

Early next year, he said, his government will ask the European Central Bank and the European commission for their assessment of Latvia's fitness to join the single currency, apply for membership, and hope to join neighbouring Estonia in the euro by the beginning of 2014.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:45:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Why do they need this when they have such amazing growth on their own?
[...]5 years without any growth in output cannot count as a "stunning expansion" [...]

[...]their "rapid growth" of the past few years is only due to the fact that they collapsed so spectacularly during the depths of the financial crisis. [...]

Perhaps salaries are low enough compared to the rest of the Euro zone that they can compete.
Or maybe they are thinking like investors: the Euro is cheap, let's buy while it's cheap.
Don't know.


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sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:10:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Enders hails `perfect' tie-up with BAE - FT.com

Tom Enders, chief executive of EADS, told staff on Wednesday that he would "soon" be in a position to make public details of its proposed £38bn combination with BAE Systems which he called "a perfect fit" in his first public statement since news of the deal leaked last week.

In a letter to the aerospace group's employees, Mr Enders said the deal was essential for the "internationalisation" of EADS and would allow it to meet its plans for long-term growth, seven years earlier than the current 2020 target date.

BAE would bring "key assets which complement our portfolio and our geographical spread", he said.

Mr Enders added: "The strategic purpose of this combination is not size. The purpose is to lay the foundation for our long-term competitiveness in the rapidly changing landscape of the aerospace and defence industry."



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:46:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Porsche cleared of market manipulation | Business News | DW.DE | 19.09.2012

A German court has rejected claims for damages against German sports carmaker Porsche resulting from its failed bid to take over Volkswagen. The ruling was the first in a raft of lawsuits for billions in damages.

The district court in Braunschweig turned down two damages claims for 3.1 million euros ($4.05 million) and 1.5 million euros respectively on Wednesday, following Porsche's argument that the investors' losses were the result of "normal financial market risks."

The plaintiffs had claimed the management of the German sports car manufacturer had "misinformed" them about plans to take over much bigger German car group Volkswagen (VW) in 2008, "enticing" them into buying shares in Volkswagen.

In 2008, Stuttgart-based Porsche staged a hostile takeover bid to acquire VW, in the course of which VW share prices fluctuated wildly, luring many speculators into making an investment.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:46:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
As I remember, it wasn't that "investors" bought VW shares, it was that futures traders made promises to supply VW shares they didn't have. Therefore, on the due date, the price of the vanishingly few VW shares that were available went through the roof and the futures traders got badly burnt.

Good.


keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:38:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Indeed.

Anyone remember "investment", where you put "money" into a "company" that you expected to "manufacture" and sell "goods" and "grow"?

-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 04:35:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
As former Bush II Attorney GeneralAlberto Gonzales might say "How quaint".

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:10:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]
News Corp shareholders in US want to sue over phone hacking scandal | Media | guardian.co.uk

Shareholders in Rupert Murdoch's News Corp are asking a US court for permission to sue the firm's board for failing to stop the phone hacking scandal.

The shareholders asked Delaware judge John Noble on Wednesday to proceed with their case against Murdoch, his sons Lachlan and James and the rest of the company's board. News Corp is attempting to have the case dismissed.

In all, 50 people have been arrested in connection with the scandal, News Corp has closed its most profitable newspaper, the News of the World newspaper, and lost a deal to take over the BSkyB satellite broadcast business.

The shareholders, including America's Amalgamated Bank and Central Laborers' Pension Funds, charge the company's executives put their own interests ahead shareholders and treated the firm as a "family candy jar".



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:01:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Apparently the Independent hires people who have been in cryogenic storage for 30-40 years:
Nowadays tabloids are mere vessels of misanthropy.

You just noticed?

In related news, working class snobbery is the true national sport.


-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 04:38:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Sudan gives chrome production licenses | Medafrica Times
A total of more than 500 mining licenses have been awarded by the Sudanese government to companies interested in producing chrome in the border state of Blue Nile close to South Sudan's border; despite the persisting violence within the two neighboring countries which has led to the fleeing of people living within the area. The United Nations puts the figure at 600,000 taking in to consideration the displacement of citizens from both countries.
The mining ministry has however ignored the circumstances surrounding the Blue Nile and more than 55 firms have shown their interest to the chrome production offer. Kamal Abdellatif, Sudan's Mining Minister, confirmed the handing out of the licenses but didn't mention anything related to the validity period of these licenses. The minister added that there are also plans to build a chrome processing refinery in order to improve the value of local production.


The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:42:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
 WORLD 


The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:20:12 PM EST
Romney's `47 percent' - here's who's actually not paying federal taxes and why | McClatchy

WASHINGTON -- Mitt Romney's controversial claim that 47 percent of Americans "pay no taxes" and are "dependent upon government" is an overstatement that put his presidential campaign on the defensive Tuesday as it scrambled to explain what he meant.

His comments came to light this week in a secretly recorded video of the Republican nominee speaking at a fundraiser in May. He made the comments while explaining how his campaign would not try to win over staunch supporters of President Barack Obama.

After media outlets began talking about the comments, Romney hurriedly held a press briefing Monday night. He said that his words "were not elegantly stated," but he refused to back away from them.

"I'm sure I can state it more clearly and in a more effective way than I did in a setting like that, and so I'm sure I'll point that out as time goes on," he said.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:57:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Romney Apologizes To Nation's 150 Million 'Starving, Filthy Beggars' | The Onion - America's Finest News Source

SALT LAKE CITY--Seeking to limit the fallout from a videotaped speech in which he asserts 47 percent of Americans "pay no taxes" and do not take "personal responsibility and care for their lives," Mitt Romney hastily called a press conference today to apologize personally to the "150 million starving, filthy beggars [he] might have offended."

Saying that he deeply regretted his choice of words at a private $50,000-a-plate fundraising function in May--during which he argued "[his] job is not to worry" about the lower-earning half of the nation's populace--Romney personally appealed to the country's "dirt-caked garbage pickers and toothless street urchins" for forgiveness.

"First and foremost, I would like to offer a heartfelt apology to all the whores, junkies, bums, and grime-covered derelicts out there who make up nearly half our nation," a visibly contrite and solemn Romney said outside a campaign stop at a local high school. "Let me assure you that I in no way meant to offend any of the putrid-smelling, barefoot masses out there. My campaign is not about dividing this nation, but about bringing all sides together--the rich, elegant members of the upper class, as well as the 47 percent who are covered in flies and eat directly from back-alley dumpsters."

"I am fully committed to building a better future for every American," Romney continued, "and that means ensuring all 150 million grease-and-urine-soaked members of our society get a fair shake."



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:00:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
to apologize personally

At last, The Onion publishes something about Republicans that could never be confused with reality.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:29:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]
S.C. working poor share anger over Romney's 47% remarks | McClatchy

ROCK HILL, S.C. -- Sandra Brown, 50, fresh off a shift in the steam and heat and sweat of a dry cleaner, sat on the front porch of a house Tuesday and reflected on the politics of the day.

It was a day after 47 percent of Americans were told by a rich guy, Mitt Romney, that his role is not to worry about them. Romney is mentioned by Brown and the other ladies on the porch as the Republican nominee for president against President Barack Obama, who was born poor before he was rich.

In a speech to other rich guys, Romney said 47 percent of the people in the country don't pay income tax. He said those people want entitlements and freebies, won't take personal responsibility and are dependent on government.

Worse, those same people vote for Obama.

"I worked since I was 13 years old," Brown said. "I worked in a mill. Then I worked at dry cleaners. I worked. I never got a welfare check in my life."



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:05:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I like that Romney has claimed he didn't inherit anything and earned his money the "old fashioned way".

no doubt Politifact will claim that is 100% true, but I'm not so sure

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:41:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
He's the son of a Governor, so he's grown up surrounded by power. That is indeed the 'old-fashioned way' called nepotism.

The American elite - more so than the Brit elite - can grow up, be educated, and go into business or politics, without ever having met dissent or alternative views. It's a cradle to grave bubble of belief, that is amplified by cars and planes that can transport you from magic home to magic office to magic corridors of power without ever setting foot in the physical world of the 99%.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:58:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Iran seeks solution to Syria conflict - Middle East - Al Jazeera English

Iran's foreign minister has met embattled Syrian President Bashar al-Assad and called for a solution to the ongoing civil war, as a rights group accused Damascus of waging "relentless, indiscriminate" attacks against its own people.

Speaking in Damascus on Wednesday, Ali Akbar Salehi said the solution to the 18-month conflict lies "only in Syria and within the Syrian family".

Salehi, who called this week for a simultaneous halt to the fighting by both regime and rebel forces, added that ending the conflict should be done in "partnership with international and regional organisations".

Following their meeting, Assad said the war engulfing Syria was targeting not only it but the "axis of resistance," a term Syria, Iran and Lebanon's Shia movement Hezbollah use to refer to their common opposition to Israel.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:34:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Iran Revolutionary Guards in Syria and Lebanon | Medafrica Times
Iran has confirmed the presence of its "military advisors" in Syria and neighboring Lebanon. It is really a scary thing because these aides, who are providing assistance to Assad regime and to Lebanese militant Shiite group of Hezbollah, are not ordinary consultants. They are members of Al Quds forces, an elite unit of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC). The Al Quds forces, a paramilitary undercover group, are tasked with exporting Iranian ideology abroad.
According to Iran's top General Mohammad Ali Jafari, these high-level advisors have been operating in Syria and Lebanon for a long time without giving more details. It seems that Tehran has finally come clean, confirming what it has long been suspected doing behind the scenes: proxy war that is already reshaping the whole Middle-East region in this Arab Spring era.
For Gen. Jafari, the Al Quds forces give for the time being the Syrian regime advice in a number of areas in which Iran has experience but warns that this could change at any time depending on the circumstances and if Syria were attacked militarily.
Iraq's fugitive Vice President Tareq al-Hashemi, a top Sunni politician, has accused the Shiite-led government of Prime Minister Nor Al-Maliki, of turning the blind to Iran's use of Iraqi airspace to fly weapons et militia fighters to Assad's killing machine, supported by Russia and China.


The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:34:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Panetta holds talks with China's Xi - Asia-Pacific - Al Jazeera English

Leon Panetta, the US defence secretary, has met Chinese leader-in-waiting Xi Jinping, who just days ago reappeared after a puzzling two-week disappearance.

The meeting on Wednesday was part of Panetta's weeklong trip through the Asia Pacific, in a campaign to pursue the US military's increased focus on the region.

Xi, who is tipped to succeed President Hu Jintao as leader of the Communist Party, stood to greet the US delegation in a lavish room in the Great Hall of the People and energetically shook Panetta's hand.

Once seated, he said Panetta's visit "will be very helpful in further advancing the state-to-state and military-to-military relations between our two countries".

The Chinese leader recently reappeared after not been seen since September 1. During his absence, he had cancelled meetings with dignitaries, including Hillary Clinton, the secretary of state.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:35:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
China-Japan dispute lifts lid on enmity | Asia | DW.DE | 18.09.2012

The dispute over islands in the East China Sea has seen both Tokyo and Beijing bow to nationalist sentiment. There are hopes that both governments will seek to ease the pressure before the tension boils over.

As major brand names became the target of protesters across China, Beijing said it would use its economic clout to punish the Japanese for buying three contested islands from a private owner last week.

China's ruling Communist Party warned that Japan's economy would suffer for up to 20 years, if Beijing imposed sanctions over the territorial row. "If Japan continues its provocations, then China will take up the battle," a front-page editorial declared.

However, such fighting talk represents something of a departure, at least where the islands, known as Diaoyu in China and Senkaku in Japan, are concerned.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:35:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Arms race on the Caspian Sea heats up | World | DW.DE | 17.09.2012

The countries bordering the Caspian Sea are increasingly flexing their military muscles. The Iran crisis and unresolved conflicts over natural resources have added to the tensions in the region.

In early September 2012, Turkmenistan conducted its first military maneuver on the Caspian Sea since gaining independence. Taking part in the maneuver were armed forces on sea and in the air, as well as ground troops and special units of the Ministry for Security and Interior Affairs.

In 1995, Turkmenistan declared its own "everlasting neutrality." The country has since actively taken part in the growing militarization of the Caspian region, say observers. The coordinator of the Joint Eurasian Expert Network "Jeen," Natalia Charitonova, pointed out that in spring 2012, neighboring Kazakhstan took its very first domestically-produced artillery vessel into operation on the Caspian Sea. Kazakhstan plans to expand its fleet by two additional such ships by 2013.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:36:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Drug kingpin captured in Venezuela | News | DW.DE | 19.09.2012

Colombian drug lord Daniel `Crazy' Barrera was arrested during an international sting in Venezuela on Tuesday. Colombian officials are hailing the arrest as one of the most important captures in recent history.

Colombian President Juan Manuel Santos said Tuesday that Daniel "Crazy" Barrera, alleged to be the country's last major drug lord, had been caught in neighbouring Venezuela in an international sting

"The last of the great capos has fallen," Santos announced on national television and radio, declaring that the US Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) and Britain's MI6 foreign intelligence service had provided support.

Barrera, whose outfit is estimated to have sent more than 900 tons of cocaine to the United States and Europe, was caught in the Venezuelan city of San Cristobal, said Santos. Barrera is also believed to have criminal ties to FARC (Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia) rebels and paramilitaries



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:36:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Headline: Romney was absolutely right

Subhead: Republicans counterattack on the 47% not paying taxes....Commentators think the controversy will help him

Israel Hayom has the highest readership in Israel. It is a free newspaper, owned by Sheldon Adelson. Most of the article is based on Ann Coulter. Israelis are sure in for a surprise in November.

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:09:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Israelis are sure in for a surprise in November.

As is Ann Coulter if she ever gets the theocratic govt she's schilling for

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:12:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Adelson has his fingers on every pie, doesn't he?

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:46:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]
T-Paw bails out.

Former Minnesota Governor Tim Pawlenty has stepped down as co-chair of Mitt Romney's presidential campaign to become chief executive of the Financial Services Roundtable, a major Wall Street lobbying group.

Pawlenty joined the Romney campaign in September 2011 after abandoning his own White House bid, following a poor showing in the Iowa straw poll a month earlier. He was considered a possible running mate for Romney before the GOP nominee tapped Representative Paul Ryan of Wisconsin.

Pawlenty will not step into his new role until Nov. 1, but he left the Romney campaign immediately because the Financial Services Roundtable is a bipartisan organization.


http://www.boston.com/politicalintelligence/2012/09/20/tim-pawlenty-leaves-mitt-romney-campaign-head -financial-lobbying-group/5T98oIDNLtduDFHJ1U99OI/story.html

In other words, he could have held off for six weeks but didn't.

by asdf on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 02:16:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
 LIVING OFF THE PLANET 
 Environment, Energy, Agriculture, Food 


The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:20:30 PM EST
U.S. oil boom comes with tradeoffs and an ugly underbelly | McClatchy

SIDNEY, Mont -- . Politicians are quick to extol the virtues of domestic oil drilling while ignoring the tradeoffs. Here in this fast-developing Western oil patch, the gritty side of America's new oil boom is on display with rising crime, a slain schoolteacher, rents that have tripled and public resources stretched thin.

That's just the half of it. Some area high schools are at historic low attendance levels, students dropping out to work the oilfields. Menial service jobs go unfilled despite high wages, and most everyone worries that the boom is transforming small-town values into something new and unpredictable.

"It's just happened so fast, and many small communities just didn't have time to plan," said Mike Coryell, executive director of the Area Economic Development Council of Miles City, a town just south of the oil boom that struggles with spillover effects. "The impacts hit but you don't have the resources to attack it.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:43:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Warming ocean could start big shift of Antarctic ice

ScienceDaily (Sep. 19, 2012) -- Fast-flowing and narrow glaciers have the potential to trigger massive changes in the Antarctic ice sheet and contribute to rapid ice-sheet decay and sea-level rise, a new study has found.

Research results published in the journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences reveal in more detail than ever before how warming waters in the Southern Ocean are connected intimately with the movement of massive ice-sheets deep in the Antarctic interior.

"It has long been known that narrow glaciers on the edge of the Antarctica act as discrete arteries termed ice streams, draining the interior of the ice sheet," says Dr Chris Fogwill, an author of the study and an ARC Future Fellow with the UNSW Climate Change Research Centre.

"However, our results have confirmed recent observations suggesting that ocean warming can trigger increased flow of ice through these narrow corridors. This can cause inland sectors of the ice-sheet -- some larger than the state of Victoria -- to become thinner and flow faster."



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:43:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Did a 'forgotten' meteor have a deadly, icy double-punch?

ScienceDaily (Sep. 19, 2012) -- When a huge meteor collided with Earth about 2.5 million years ago and fell into the southern Pacific Ocean it not only could have generated a massive tsunami but also may have plunged the world into the Ice Ages, a new study suggests.

A team of Australian researchers says that because the Eltanin meteor -- which was up to two kilometres across -- crashed into deep water, most scientists have not adequately considered either its potential for immediate catastrophic impacts on coastlines around the Pacific rim or its capacity to destabilise the entire planet's climate system.

"This is the only known deep-ocean impact event on the planet and it's largely been forgotten because there's no obvious giant crater to investigate, as there would have been if it had hit a landmass," says Professor James Goff, lead author of a forthcoming paper in the Journal of Quaternary Science. Goff is co-director of UNSW's Australia-Pacific Tsunami Research Centre and Natural Hazards Research Laboratory.

"But consider that we're talking about something the size of a small mountain crashing at very high speed into very deep ocean, between Chile and Antarctica. Unlike a land impact, where the energy of the collision is largely absorbed locally, this would have generated an incredible splash with waves literally hundreds of metres high near the impact site.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:44:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
they say the earth was in a cooling phase, but they don't say what was going on. After all, we know that due to to perturbations in the earth's orbit, we cycle between warm and cold climates every few thousand years. I can't remember exactly how long those cycles are but one at least is 47,000 years.

How were things different 2M5 years ago that this represented a game change from a permanently warm climate into a cyclic one ?

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:49:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Massive worldwide slaughter of farm animals set to push food prices up 14 percent | The Raw Story

Farmers who cannot afford feed `liquidating' pig and cattle herds will drive food inflation to record high, says Rabobank report

The mass slaughter of millions of farm animals across the world is expected to push food prices to their highest ever levels.

As well as hitting consumers' pockets, the predicted 14% jump in food prices will also dash the Bank of England's hopes of pushing inflation down to 2% by next year.

Farmers across the world have begun a mass slaughter of their pig and cattle herds because they cannot afford the cost of feed, which has soared following the worst US drought in living memory, according to a report published on Wednesday.

Experts at investment bank Rabobank warn that the mass "herd liquidation" will contribute to a 14% jump in the price of the average basket of food by next summer.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 03:44:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If major slaughter of animals, meat prices down.

Logically.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 11:44:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Briefly down, then up.

The 'briefly' could be shorter - if there isn't enough capacity in meat processing and the excess is just dumped ... somewhere - or longer - if we have really good refrigeration or are willing to live on dried/frozen/salted/cured meats.

-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 11:59:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 12:05:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Monsanto weedkiller and GM maize in 'shocking' cancer study | News | The Grocer

The world's best-selling weedkiller, and a genetically modified maize resistant to it, can cause tumours, multiple organ damage and lead to premature death, new research published today reveals.

In the first ever study to examine the long-term effects of Monsanto's Roundup weedkiller, or the NK603 Roundup-resistant GM maize also developed by Monsanto, scientists found that rats exposed to even the smallest amounts, developed mammary tumours and severe liver and kidney damage as early as four months in males, and seven months for females, compared with 23 and 14 months respectively for a control group.

"This research shows an extraordinary number of tumours developing earlier and more aggressively - particularly in female animals. I am shocked by the extreme negative health impacts," said Dr Michael Antoniou, molecular biologist at King's College London, and a member of CRIIGEN, the independent scientific council which supported the research.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 03:45:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Un maïs OGM de Monsanto soupçonné de toxicité Monsanto GMO maize suspected of toxicity
L'étude conduite par le biologiste Gilles-Eric Séralini (université de Caen) et à paraître dans la prochaine édition de la revue Food and Chemical Toxicology fait grand bruit : elle est la première à suggérer des effets délétères, sur le rat, de la consommation d'un maïs génétiquement modifié - dit NK603, commercialisé par la firme Monsanto - associé ou non au Round-Up, l'herbicide auquel il est rendu tolérant.The study led by biologist Gilles-Eric Seralini (University of Caen) and published in the next edition of the journal Food and Chemical Toxicology is making quite a stir: it is the first to suggest deleterious effects on the rat, from consumption of genetically modified maize NK603, marketed by Monsanto -- with or without the Roundup herbicide to which it is tolerant.
Les auteurs ont mis en place un protocole expérimental particulièrement ambitieux. Ils ont testé - sur un total de plus de 200 rats, et pendant deux ans - les effets d'un régime alimentaire composé de trois doses différentes du maïs transgénique (11 %, 22 % et 33 %), cultivé ou non avec son herbicide-compagnon.The authors implemented a particularly ambitious experimental protocol. They tested -- on a total of more than 200 rats, and over two years -- the effects of a diet consisting of three different doses of transgenic maize (11%, 22% and 33%), cultivated or not with its herbicide-companion.
Trois groupes ont également été testés avec des doses croissantes du produit phytosanitaire seul, non associé à l'OGM. Au total, donc, ce sont neuf groupes de 20 rats (3 groupes avec OGM, 3 groupes avec OGM et Roundup, 3 groupes avec Roundup) qui ont été comparés à un groupe témoin, nourri avec la variété de maïs non transgénique la plus proche de l'OGM testé, sans traitement à l'herbicide.Three groups were also tested with increasing doses of the herbicide alone, not associated with GMOs. In total, therefore, nine groups of 20 rats (3 groups with GMOs, 3 groups with GMOs and Roundup, 3 groups with Roundup), were compared to a control group fed with a non-transgenic maize variety closest to the GMO tested, without herbicide treatment.

Significant differences in outcomes from the control group were noted after about a year. Liver congestion and necrosis 2.5% to 5.5% more frequent, severe kidney disorders 1.3% to 2.3% more frequent. Mortality: 30% of males and 20% of females died "prematurely" in the control group, as against 50% males and 70% females in the test groups (benchmark: average age of death of the control group).

Les auteurs de ces travaux notent que la majorité des effets détectés ne sont pas proportionnels aux doses d'OGM ou d'herbicide auxquelles ont été exposés les animaux. Cette absence de proportionnalité entre la dose et la réponse biologique - une petite dose peut produire des effets plus importants que des doses plus fortes -, est désormais bien documentée dans le cas des substances qui perturbent le système hormonal.The authors of the study note that the majority of detected effects are not proportional to the dose of GMO or herbicide the animals have been exposed to. This lack of proportionality between dose and biological response -- a small dose can produce greater effects than higher doses -- is now well documented in the case of substances that disrupt the hormone system.
Selon les auteurs, le Round-Up pourrait donc se comporter comme un perturbateur endocrinien. Cependant, cela n'explique pas les effets mesurés sur les animaux nourris à l'OGM seul. Pour les auteurs, la construction génétique de l'OGM entraîne la modification d'une enzyme (dite ESPS synthase) impliquée dans la synthèse d'acides aminés aromatiques ayant un effet de protection contre la cancérogénèse. According to the authors, Round-Up could therefore behave as an endocrine disruptor. However, this does not explain the effects measured on animals fed GMOs alone. For the authors, the genetic construction of the GMO involves altering an enzyme (called ESPS synthase) involved in the synthesis of aromatic amino-acids which have a protective effect against carcinogenesis.

jusqu'à présent, de nombreuses études de toxicologie ont été menées sur différents OGM et sur différentes espèces animales, sans montrer de différences biologiquement significatives entre les animaux témoins et ceux nourris avec les végétaux modifiés. Cependant, la plupart de ces travaux, rassemblés dans une récente revue de littérature conduite par Chelsea Snell (université de Nottingham, Royaume-Uni) et publiée en janvier dans Food and Chemical Toxicology, ont été menés sur des durées très inférieures à deux ans, et avec un plus faible nombre de paramètres biologiques contrôlés chez les animaux. De plus, tous ou presque ont été financés ou directement menés par les firmes agrochimiques elles-mêmes....up to now, many toxicology studies have been conducted on different GMOs and different animal species, without showing biologically significant differences between the control animals and those fed the modified plants. However, most of this work, collected in a recent review of the literature conducted by Chelsea Snell (University of Nottingham, United Kingdom) and published in January in Food and Chemical Toxicology was conducted over periods much shorter than two years, and with a smaller number of biological parameters tested for in the animals. In addition, almost all were funded or directly carried out by the agro-chemical companies themselves.
Les travaux de M. Séralini - dont le budget s'est élevé selon lui à plus de 3 millions d'euros - ont, pour leur part, été financés par la Fondation Charles-Léopold Mayer, par l'association CERES (qui rassemble notamment des entreprises de la grande distribution), le ministère français de la recherche et le Criigen (Comité de recherche et d'information indépendantes sur le génie génétique), une association qui milite contre les biotechnologies.Mr. Séralini's work -- with a budget that he decribes as more than 3 million euros -- was funded by the Foundation Charles Leopold Mayer, the association CERES (which consists mainly of mass distribution companies), the French Ministry of Research and Criigen (Committee for Research and Independent Information on Genetic Engineering), a group that campaigns against biotechnology.
En tout état de cause, cette nouvelle publication sera placée sous l'attention soutenue de l'ensemble de la communauté scientifique et des agrochimistes, qui y chercheront les biais possibles et les faiblesses expérimentales. Interrogé par Le Monde, M. Séralini s'engage à fournir à la communauté scientifique l'ensemble des données brutes de son expérience - ce que ne font pas les agrochimistes qui mènent ce type d'études -, afin qu'elles puissent être réanalysées par ses contradicteurs.In any event, this new publication will undergo the sustained attention of the whole scientific community and the agro-chemists, who will be looking for possible biases and experimental weaknesses. Questioned by Le Monde Mr. Séralini undertook to provide the scientific community with all the experimental raw data of experience -- which agrochemists working on this type of study do not do -- so they can be re-analyzed by his opponents.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 04:47:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]
afew:
2.5% to 5.5% more frequent, severe kidney disorders 1.3% to 2.3% more frequent.

2.5 to 5.5 TIMES more frequent, and 1.3 to 2.3 TIMES more frequent, respectively.

(Just a minor error of two orders of magnitude, to see if you were paying attention.)

Looks like the "precautionary principle" cry-babies were right. But perhaps Jake or Nomad will explain otherwise. </ cheap provocation>

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:32:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Ach, that's what I understood I was saying... It's better with "times" in though...

On the precautionary principle, it has always been clear that the FDA's decision to classify GMOs as "substantially equivalent" to non-GMOs from the point of view of health risks was nothing more than a direct manipulation to save American biotech, essentially Monsanto, the time and trouble of doing proper research, allowing them to quickly reach a dominant position on world markets.

The second question concerns glyphosate. When it acts as a herbicide ie kills plants, no animal (beyond micro-organisms) consumes the result. When it is sprayed on resistant future crops, since it is systemic, entering every part of the plant including grain, it is ultimately consumed. The long-term health effects of consuming glyphosate (or the molecules it breaks down to within plants) have been inadequately researched.

Tha agencies that are supposed to protect us (FDA, EFSA) are infiltrated and run by agro-chemical industry shills.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:57:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
But not yet cheap enough. :)

I don't generate instant denialism/scepticism everywhere, really. And I thought I had expressed my concerns with the rampant use of pesticides and antibiotics even here, but well. In fact, I'm not even too surprised with anything that deals with Roundup, which from the start should've been tested as a composite, not just merely on the active component. IMHO, there remains a frightful gap in European legislation which makes it possible to slip newly developed industry products on European soil without proper testing.

But so you know, I'll judge this paper, like any other, on its merits. :)

by Nomad on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:10:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I saw somewhere that 30% of the control rats got cancer, so I assume that it's a strain bred/engineered to develop lots of cancers?
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:43:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Monsanto weedkiller and GM maize in 'shocking' cancer study | News | The Grocer

Up to half the male rats and 70% of females died prematurely, compared with only 30% and 20% in the control group. Across both sexes the researchers found that rats fed Roundup in their water or NK603 developed two to three times more large tumours than the control group. By the beginning of the 24th month, 50-80% of females in all treated groups had developed large tumours, with up to three per animal.

By contrast, only 30% of the control group were affected.

Well, the mean life expectancy of the control group of lab rats was 624 days for males and 701 days for females. Perhaps rats who live to such a ripe old age in the wild develop lots of cancers, just like us.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:53:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That is what the opponents of the study are already claiming.

In fact cancer was not central to the study, though the press has certainly focussed on that.

But Le Monde has just posted an interview with a specialist who says the study presents serious methodological flaws, one of which is that according to the OECD (who knew the OECD laid down experimental protocols?) cancer experiments should use groups of at least 50 test animals. Further, that the line of lab rats used, Sprague-Dawley, is known for a high likelihood of contracting cancer and is therefore never used in cancer research (despite the fact that the Seralini study was not specifically designed to identify cancer risks...).

Next, insufficient information is provided on the feed given the rats beyond GMO maize, and analyses that might have shown the presence of mycotoxins were not presented. Regular biophysical data on the state of the animals is also not presented.

The specialist concludes that he does not understand how such a study got into a serious peer-reviewed organ. He also suggests that Seralini is doing this to promote his new book Tous Cobayes (We are all guinea-pigs).

Seralini has said that he will make all his data public, so some of these alleged failings may be cleared up. It is also the case that agro-indistry studies (funded or in-house) do not make their data available in some cases even to regulatory agencies such as the FDA.

The specialist?

OGM : "Le protocole d'étude de M. Séralini présente des lacunes rédhibitoires" GM: "The study protocol has shortcomings Séralini Mr. crippling"
Gérard Pascal, ancien toxicologue spécialiste des OGM à l'Institut national de la recherche agronomique (INRA), aujourd'hui consultant pour des entreprises agroalimentairesGérard Pascal, a former toxicologist specialised in GMOs at the (French) National Institute of Agronomic Research (INRA), now a consultant for agro-food companies

INRA is of course part of the French agro-establishment in bed with productivist farming and the food industry.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 10:23:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]
one of which is that according to the OECD (who knew the OECD laid down experimental protocols?) cancer experiments should use groups of at least 50 test animals.

OK, I was tempted to look at the study itself to see how much it resembles the press writeup. But that right there? That tells me that I probably don't need to. If that's the best that a professional nitpicker could come up with, I doubt a happy amateur like me could find any serious flaws.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 10:30:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
In fact the OECD does publish guidelines. But I find it hard to believe that they are considered as the Bible by professional researchers. And though Pascal admits Seralini was avowedly not testing for cancer, most of his argument assumes that that was the case.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 10:47:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If Seralini was not testing for cancer his results are not significant per se. But if his experiment was properly conducted he has found an indication that should be tested in a targeted study.

Ideally double-blind, etc...

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 10:54:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Note the hepatic and renal disorders.

If I understand the design of the study (which may contain flaws, of course), it was to observe health outcomes when rats were fed GM maize and/or glyphosate over a lifetime.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 11:02:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]
So it was open-ended, and so the observation of increased cancer is significant. However, the fact that the strain of rats used spontaneously develops cancer at high rates tends to cloud the conclusions.

Maybe they could start with "glyphosate causes cyrrhosis of the liver" and see how Monsantobots reply.

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 11:18:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
is that never has such a lifetime study been carried out before.

Given that the GMO industry has been able to establish itself purely because regulators have accepted their brazen affirmation that there is no need for any such studies, because there is no substantial difference between GMO and non-GMO crops, I think this is a watershed moment.

I think the French agriculture minister's reaction, that the EU's GMO regime needs revising, and the French Prime Minister's suggestion that if the dangers are confirmed, France will call for a Europe-wide ban, will be the predominant ones in Europe, and will signal the end in the medium term of industrial-scale GMO cultivation and use in the EU.

i.e. at the very least, serious testing will be required for the issuing of permits... retrospectively? Which imposes an additional 2 years delay at a minimum, even if any particular variety should come up clean.

It may not make any difference in the US, on the other hand.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 11:29:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Or, more's the pity, countries like India.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 11:47:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, if the study has obvious flaws it should be possible to replicate it with the flaws corrected (larger sample size, different mice strains, etc)...

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 10:33:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Money must be made available for that, and the industry kept out of it.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 10:49:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
EU Observer: Scientist against EU agency double-checking GMO findings
"It's out of the question that those who authorised NK603 carry out a counter-study of our findings as there'd be a conflict of interest."


I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 04:50:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Indeed.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 04:55:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]
We need a new snowclone: Throw X at Y.

(Money/resource at a problem, Rodents at a study.)


-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 10:53:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Link to the full paper on this study (pdf)

If somebody wants to give a look. I read it, and my main conclusion is that we should require systemtic 2 year-long tests on rats. I'm not convinced by the statistical analysis, but that is because I'm not familiar with that kind of reasonning. I wouldnt reproach a lack here because I know for sure that scientific journals are littered with papers that do not follow even simple rules in statistical analysis. I'm not even pointing to the huge number of curve with three points that you may find there... without any complaints.

A free fox in a free henhouse!

by Xavier in Paris on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 12:52:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If the guy publishesthe raw data a proper analysis of variance/covariance can be carried out. If the sample size is 20 per group in a 3x2x2 contingency array, that's already pretty good.

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 12:56:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It's 10-rat groups. They divided by sex, so 10 males, 10 females in each case.



They tested GMO alone, GMO+roundup, Round up + non GMO, and 3 dosis of GMO from 11% to 33% if I'm correct.

Long term toxicity of a Roundup herbicide and a Roundup-tolerant genetically modified
maize


Quelques extraits:


Abstract



The health effects of a Roundup-tolerant genetically modified maize (from 11% in the diet), cultivated with or without Roundup, and Roundup alone (from 0.1 ppb in water), were studied 2 years in
rats. In females, all treated groups died 2-3 times more than controls, and more rapidly. This difference was visible in 3 male groups fed GMOs. All results were hormone and sex dependent, and the
pathological profiles were comparable. Females developed large mammary tumors almost always more often than and before controls, the pituitary was the second most disabled organ; the sex hormonal
balance was modified by GMO and Roundup treatments. In treated males, liver congestions and necrosis were 2.5-5.5 times higher. This pathology was confirmed by optic and transmission electron
microscopy. Marked and severe kidney nephropathies were also generally 1.3-2.3 greater. Males presented 4 times more large palpable tumors than controls which occurred up to 600 days earlier.
Biochemistry data confirmed very significant kidney chronic deficiencies; for all treatments and both sexes, 76% of the altered parameters were kidney related. These results can be explained by the
non linear endocrine-disrupting effects of Roundup, but also by the overexpression of the transgene in the GMO and its metabolic consequences.





2. Materials and methods a écrit:2.2. Plants, diets and chemicals



The varieties of maize used in this study were the R-tolerant NK603 (Monsanto Corp., USA), and its nearest isogenic non-transgenic control. These two types of maize were grown under similar normal
conditions, in the same location, spaced at a sufficient distance to avoid cross-contamination. The genetic nature, as well as the purity of the GM seeds and harvested material, was confirmed by qPCR
analysis of DNA samples. One field of NK603 was treated with R at 3 L ha−1 (WeatherMAX, 540 g/L of glyphosate, EPA Reg. 524-537), and another field of NK603 was not treated with R. Corns were
harvested when the moisture content was less than 30% and were dried at a temperature below 30 °C. From these three cultivations of maize, laboratory rat chow was made based on the standard diet A04
(Safe, France). The dry rat feed was made to contain 11, 22 or 33% of GM maize, cultivated either with or without R, or 33% of the non-transgenic control line. The concentrations of the transgene
were confirmed in the three doses of each diet by qPCR. All feed formulations consisted in balanced diets, chemically measured as substantially equivalent except for the transgene, with no
contaminating pesticides over standard limits. All secondary metabolites cannot be known and measured in the composition. However we have measured isoflavones and phenolic acids including ferulic
acid by standard HPLC-UV. All reagents used were of analytical grade. The herbicide diluted in the drinking water was the commercial formulation of R (GT Plus, 450 g/L of glyphosate, approval
2020448, Monsanto, Belgium). Herbicides levels were assessed by glyphosate measurements in the different dilutions by mass spectrometry.





2.3. Animals and treatments



Virgin albino Sprague-Dawley rats at 5 weeks of age were obtained from Harlan (Gannat, France). All animals were kept in polycarbonate cages (820 cm2, Genestil, France) with two animals of the same
sex per cage. The litter (Toplit classic, Safe, France) was replaced twice weekly. The animals were maintained at 22 ± 3 °C under controlled humidity (45-65%) and air purity with a 12 h-light/dark
cycle, with free access to food and water. The location of each cage within the experimental room was regularly moved. This 2 year life-long experiment was conducted in a GPL environment according to
OECD guidelines. After 20 days of acclimatization, 100 male and 100 female animals were randomly assigned on a weight basis into 10 equivalent groups. "font-weight: bold">For each sex, one control group had access to plain water and standard diet from the closest isogenic non-transgenic maize control; six groups were fed with 11, 22 and 33% of GM
NK603 maize either treated or not with R. The final three groups were fed with the control diet and had access to water supplemented with respectively 1.1 × 10−8% of R (0.1 ppb of R or 50 ng/L
of glyphosate, the contaminating level of some regular tap waters), 0.09% of R (400 mg/kg, US MRL of glyphosate in some GM feed) and 0.5% of R (2.25 g/L, half of the minimal agricultural working
dilution).
This was changed weekly. Twice weekly monitoring allowed careful observation and palpation of animals, recording of clinical signs, measurement of any tumors that may arise,
food and water consumption, and individual body weights.





2.6. Statistical analysis



Biochemical data were treated by multivariate analysis with the SIMCA-P (V12) software (UMETRICS AB Umea, Sweden). The use of chemometrics tools, for example, principal component analysis (PCA),
partial least-squares to latent structures (PLS), and orthogonal PLS (OPLS), are robust methods for modeling, analyzing and interpreting complex chemical and biological data. OPLS is a recent
modification of the PLS method. PLS is a regression method used in order to find the relationship between two data tables referred to as X and Y. PLS regression (Eriksson et al., 2006b) analysis
consists in calculating by means of successive iterations, linear combinations of the measured X-variables (predictor variables). These linear combinations of X-variables give PLS components (score
vectors t). A PLS component can be thought of as a new variable - a latent variable - reflecting the information in the original X-variables that is of relevance for modeling and predicting the
response Y-variable by means of the maximization of the square of covariance (Max cov2(X,Y)). The number of components is determined by cross validation. SIMCA software uses the Nonlinear Iterative
Partial Least Squares algorithm (NIPALS) for the PLS regression. Orthogonal Partial Least Squares Discriminant Analysis (OPLS-DA) was used in this study ( [Weljie et al., 2011] and [Wiklund et al.,
2008]). The purpose of Discriminant Analysis is to find a model that separates groups of observations on the basis of their X variables. The X matrix consists of the biochemical data. The Y matrix
contains dummy variables which describe the group membership of each observation. Binary variables are used in order to encode a group identity. Discriminant analysis finds a discriminant plan in
which the projected observations are well separated according to each group. The objective of OPLS is to divide the systematic variation in the X-block into two model parts, one linearly related to Y
(in the case of a discriminant analysis, the group membership), and the other one unrelated (orthogonal) to Y. Components related to Y are called predictive, and those unrelated to Y are called
orthogonal. This partitioning of the X data results in improved model transparency and interpretability (Eriksson et al., 2006a). Prior to analysis, variables were mean-centered and unit variance
scaled.





Image

Fig. 1. Mortality of rats fed GMO treated or not with Roundup, and effects of Roundup alone. Rats were fed with NK603 GM maize (with or without application of Roundup) at three different
doses (11, 22, 33% in their diet: thin, medium and bold lines, respectively) compared to the substantially equivalent closest isogenic non-GM maize (control, dotted line). Roundup was administrated
in drinking water at 3 increasing doses, same symbols (environmental (A), MRL in agricultural GMOs (B) and half of minimal agricultural
levels (C)
, see Section 2). Lifespan during the experiment for the control group is represented by the vertical bar ± SEM (grey area). In bar histograms, the causes of mortality before
the grey area are detailed in comparison to the controls (0). In black are represented the necessary euthanasia because of suffering in accordance with ethical rules (tumors over 25% body weight,
more than 25% weight loss, hemorrhagic bleeding, etc.); and in hatched areas, spontaneous mortality.







Image

Fig. 2. Largest non-regressive tumors in rats fed GMO treated or not by Roundup, and effects of Roundup alone. The symbols of curves and treatments are explained in the caption of Fig. 1.
The largest tumors were palpable during the experiment and numbered from 20 mm in diameter for males and 17.5 mm for females. Above this size, 95% of growths were non-regressive tumors. Summary of
all tumors are shown in the bar histograms: black, non regressive largest tumors; white, small internal tumors; grey, metastases.





Image

Fig. 5. Orthogonal Partial Least Squares-Discriminant Analysis (OPLS-DA) for biochemical data (females fed 33% GMO versus controls). (A) OPLS-DA regression coefficients for predictive
component, with jack-knifed confidence intervals at 99% confidence level, indicate discriminant parameters versus controls at month 15 (Abbreviations: U Urinary, UEx Excreted in urine during 24 h,
APPT Activated Partial Thromboplastin Time, MCV Mean Corpuscular Volume, PT Prothrombine Time, RBC Red Blood Cells, ALT ALanine aminoTransferase, MCHC Mean Corpuscular Hemoglobin Concentration, A/G
Albumin/Globulin ratio, WBC White Blood Cells, AST aspartate aminotransferase). (B) In this case, detailed examples of significant
discriminant variables distribution between females fed 33% GMO (bold line) and controls (dotted line)
. On x axis: animals; on y axis: serum or urine biochemical values for Na, Cl,
estradiol, testosterone. Profiles evidence kidney ion leakages and sex hormonal imbalance versus controls.

For biochemical measurements in rats, statistical analysis was performed on the results obtained from samples taken at the
15th month time point, as this was the last sampling time when most animals were still alive (in treated groups 90% males, 94% females, and 100% controls).
OPLS-DA 2-class models were
built between each treated group per sex and controls. Only models with an explained variance R2(Y) ⩾ 80%, and a cross-validated predictive ability Q2(Y) ⩾ 60%, were used for selection
of the discriminant variables (Fig. 5A), when their regression coefficients were significant at 99% confidence level. Thus, in treated females, kidney failures appeared at the biochemical level (82%
of the total disrupted parameters). Ions (Na, Cl) or urea increased in urine. Accordingly, the same ions decreased in serum (Fig. 5B) as did the levels of P, K and Ca. Creatinine or clairance
decreased in urine for all treatment groups in comparison to female controls (Table 3). In GM maize treated males (with or without R), 87% of discriminant variables were kidney related, but the
disrupted profiles were less obvious because of advanced chronic nephropathies and deaths. In summary, for all treatments and both sexes, 76% of the discriminant variables versus controls were kidney
related.





3. Results:
The lifespan of the control group of animals corresponded to the mean rat lifespan, but as is frequently the case with most mammals including humans
(WHO, 2012), males on average died before females, except for some female treatment groups. All treatments in both sexes enhanced large
tumor incidence by 2-3-fold in comparison to our controls
but also for the number of mammary tumors in comparison to the same Harlan Sprague Dawley strain (Brix et al., 2005), and
overall around 3-fold in comparison to the largest study with 1329 Sprague Dawley female rats (Chandra et al., 1992). In our study the tumors also developed considerably faster than the controls,
even though the majority of tumors were observed after 18 months. The first large detectable tumors occurred at 4 and 7
months into the study in males and females respectively, underlining the inadequacy of the standard 90 day feeding trials for evaluating GM crop and food toxicity (Séralini et al.,
2011).



The similar pathological profiles provoked by the GM maize containing R residues may thus be explained at least by R residues themselves, knowing that the medium dose of the R treatment
corresponds to acceptable levels of this pesticide residues in GMOs.

Interestingly, in the groups of animals fed with the NK603 without R application, similar effects with respect to enhanced tumor incidence and mortality rates were observed.











conclusion:

[...]We propose that agricultural edible GMOs and formulated pesticides must be evaluated very carefully by long term studies to measure their potential toxic effects.


A free fox in a free henhouse!
by Xavier in Paris on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 01:33:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That looks like a very good design, still. I'll have to read up to on the significance level.

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:28:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]
My opinion is that it is a good first study. It would need to be completed by others before we could really say that there is a link between MGO and cancers.

Nevertheless, and I believe that this was the initial objective, it seems clear to me that regulatory test during three months are clearly insufficient.

A free fox in a free henhouse!

by Xavier in Paris on Fri Sep 21st, 2012 at 03:05:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yeah. I suppose the most amazing thing is that it's being published at all, after decades of successful denialism.

The denialist hatchet job published by Le Monde couldn't find anything better than to criticise the sample size, claiming that the study shouldn't have been published because of its obvious insufficiency. The denialist no doubt knows that the researcher had to do what he could with the budget he had; and no doubt the study could not have happened at all, if the sample size precondition had to be met.

It takes a courageous scientist to swim against the current. More power to Gilles-Eric Séralini.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Fri Sep 21st, 2012 at 04:53:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

"-So, it seems that it might be possible to...
...that the MGO maize, or better some MGO maizes...
-Keep it short!
-Yes, so, there is that study the reveals that rats fed NK603 maize hae developped cancer golf ball sized.
-OKOK, so what?
-So nothing, It was just to tell you. Off course we would need to make some more expertises...
-You really were tactfull!
-It's the precautionnary principle. It has to be used somewhere."


A free fox in a free henhouse!

by Xavier in Paris on Fri Sep 21st, 2012 at 06:43:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Unpossible.
by asdf on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 05:58:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Who Could Have Predicted?

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:50:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The West Australian - GM crop could cause liver failure: scientist

A world-renowned scientist has warned that one of the CSIRO's genetically modified wheat varieties has the potential to cause a deadly disease that attacks the liver.

In his report on GM wheat that is expected to be released today, New Zealand genetics lecturer Jack Heinemann, from the University of Canterbury, said the CSIRO's technology suppressed an enzyme in the wheat which was similar to the human enzyme that produces glycogen.

Humans eating the wheat could find the technology suppresses glycogen production in their bodies, leading to liver failure.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 04:42:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Call to abandon GM trials 'scaremongering' - State News - Grains and Cropping - Wheat - Farm Weekly
THE Western Australia government has dismissed opposition calls to abandon a genetically modified (GM) wheat trial in the light of health concerns as "scaremongering".
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 12:09:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]
In case anyone had any doubts that the Euro crisis is religious in nature:

CNBC: ECB Bond Buying Likened to Work of the Devil (19 Sep 2012)

After weeks of macro-economic sniping following his isolation at the European Central Bank over its new bond-buying policy, Jens Weidmann, on Tuesday resorted to Goethe's Faust to make his point. The classic play highlighted, he argued, "the core problem of today's paper money-based monetary policy" and the "potentially dangerous correlation of paper money creation, state financing and inflation".

In early scenes from Goethe's tragedy, Mephistopheles persuades the heavily indebted Holy Roman Emperor to print paper money - notionally backed by gold that had not yet been mined - to solve an economic crisis, with initially happy results until more and more money is printed and rampant inflation ensues.

While he did not make the comparison from Faust Part Two explicit, for Mr Weidmann there are clearly parallels with the performance of the ECB in trying to save the euro.

I really had a hard time deciding whether to put this in the Europe section, Economy section, or Klatsch section, so I figured "off the planetreservation" works.

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 05:21:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I think it is telling that right wingers have to constantly use works of fiction (most notable Atlas Shrugged) to justify their policies.

I mean, I will make the occasional reference to Orwell but that's mostly to save space as it replaces a description.
What we are seeing from the right wing is policies implemented because in a book by either a demented woman (Rand) or a Romantic writer writing long before macroeconomics were even dreamt off (Goethe) someone doing something else got unwanted results.

Earth provides enough to satisfy every man's need, but not every man's greed. Gandhi

by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:26:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Cyrille:
a Romantic writer writing long before macroeconomics were even dreamt off (Goethe)

This is taking blasphemy a bit too far. Can you at least leave Goethe alone?

The minister for economy and finance Goethe had a profound knowledge of economics and exchanged letters with all German economists of his time. He understood what he was writing there, and Weidmann relies on his audience not having read Faust.

by Katrin on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 04:49:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I could answer that German economist remains an oxymoron to these days.
Or that Goethe died in 1832. That is, at least 90 years before the foundation of macro-economics.

He had no concept of fiat currency.

No, basing current monetary policy on Goethe does not make sense.
Calling it blasphemy does not make much either.

Earth provides enough to satisfy every man's need, but not every man's greed. Gandhi

by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:45:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Cyrille:
He had no concept of fiat currency

That makes him so attractive for Weidmann.

Cyrille:

Calling it blasphemy does not make much either.

That's right. I always ought to keep my tongue out of my cheek. :(   And now leave Goethe alone.

by Katrin on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:51:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
OK, apologies if it was tongue in cheek, I'm not the best detector of sarcasm around.
But then is this: "And now leave Goethe alone." also tongue in cheek?

Otherwise, why?

Earth provides enough to satisfy every man's need, but not every man's greed. Gandhi

by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 07:14:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes, also tongue in cheek, I am afraid. I promise I'll reform.
by Katrin on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 08:17:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
No Leave Goethe Alone videos?
Just think of the period costumes!

(Haven't read "Werther" but it could be a fan fic today. I'm afraid it would probably have vampires.)


-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 08:28:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Sven!

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 08:50:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Sie streiten sich um Freiheitsrechte;
Genau besehn, sind's Knechte gegen Knechte
by Katrin on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 08:52:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Faust II. What else?
by Katrin on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 08:52:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I haven't read Goethe's writings on economics, maybe I should, I don't know if it's worth it outside of historical interest. And, yes, he was a finance minister for some time and as minister opposed an expansion of the money supply through paper money. Voltaire's quip that "paper money always reverts to its intrinsic value, zero" is also widely quoted by gold bugs.

Goethe also wrote about the theory of colour vision. While that was a qualitative theory and not the quantitative theory now in vogue, it was not incorrect. But it emphasised the subjective experience of colour vision whereas the current quantitative theory attempt to describe that which is common across most people.

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:11:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I haven't read Goethe's writings on economics, maybe I should,

Are there any, besides Faust? (And why is it so hard to find a simple table of contents of the Weimar Ausgabe online?)

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:22:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I don't know... there is enough stuff to curate an exhibition:
The "Goethe.Auf.Geld." (Goethe.On.Money.) exhibition will be held at the Deutsche Bundesbank's Money Museum from 16 September to 9 December 2012. Drawing on the Bundesbank's extensive collection of coins and banknotes, it offers a fascinating insight into how the greatest figure in Germany's literary and intellectual history has been portrayed through the medium of money.

The exhibition shows the different and often surprising ways in which Goethe and his works have appeared on various types of money from the 19th century to the present day. Each generation has recorded and handed down to posterity its own unique impression of Goethe on coins and banknotes.

The special exhibition "Goethe.Auf.Geld." is the Deutsche Bundesbank's contribution to the "Goethe und das Geld" (Goethe and Money) week in Frankfurt in 2012.

Weidmann was speaking at the presentation of the exhibition.

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:28:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The only actual work of Goethe mentioned in the flyer is Faust II ....
by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:30:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]
There's also the Goethe Festwoche 2012 introduction, and what appears to be at least a 4-part blog on Goethe and money as it relates to the current crisis: Goethe, das Geld und die aktuelle Krise (4): ,,Immer neue Gräber auf dem Friedhof der Papiergeldwährungen".

When the ECB flyer reminds us that Goethe is "the greatest genius in German cultural and spiritual history" we know why Katrin use a "blasphemy" metaphor. Tread lightly.

einen faszinierenden Einblick in die geldgestalterische Auseinandersetzung mit dem größten Genie der deutschen Kultur- und Geistesgeschichte.


I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:35:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Migeru:
When the ECB flyer reminds us that Goethe is "the greatest genius in German cultural and spiritual history" we know why Katrin use a "blasphemy" metaphor. Tread lightly.

At last.

I recommend reading the FAZ conversation with Binswanger and Ackermann. It gives some insights in the question "evil or stupid".

by Katrin on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:59:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, we know who Goethe is. But while we're on the topic of religion, are we supposed to not criticise Goethe's nonfiction works (as naturalist, physiologist and economist) in the light of modern understandings of science on the off chance that some German, somewhere, might feel offended?

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 07:10:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
What about the fiction? His praise of asbestos (Faust II again)?
Uns bleibt ein Erdenrest
Zu tragen peinlich,
Und wär er von Asbest ,
Er ist nicht reinlich
by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 07:15:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
No, from an economical point of view there is Faust  and then for a long while nothing else. I think Faust would keep you busy for a while anyway. How is this table?
by Katrin on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:50:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The cool thing about Atlas Shrugged is that the reader gets to be God, not just carry out His will.

-----
sapere aude
by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:16:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]
the protagonists are devils conveniently unanchored to any quaint concepts of morality, such as the great churches profess and then ignore.

rand was pitiful in her megalomania.

It's a fine line between homage, parody, and consumer opportunism. Jess Walter

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:55:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Here is Prof. Binswanger and Josef Ackermann discussing Faust II, stimulating the economy, and inflation more in depth than Weidmann in his speech. Neither of the three mentions that Goethe explained trinity in the same works: think trade, war, and piracy, and you've got it.
by Katrin on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:17:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
New Zealand's Whanganui River is Granted Legal Personhood Status | Inhabitat - Sustainable Design Innovation, Eco Architecture, Green Building
The lives of human beings and rivers have been intertwined since the beginning of mankind, but modern society rarely affords waterways significant protection. Which is what makes a decision by officials in New Zealand to grant the Whanganui River legal personhood status--with its own "rights and interests"--such a intriguing milestone.


Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 06:00:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
So... does that mean it's going to start contributing to political action committees?

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:03:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If someone drowns, is that murder ?

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 03:51:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
or cannibalism?
by Katrin on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 04:52:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It has personhood status just like a company has. Once they start convicting companies for murder (and, in the U.S., executing them) we can return to this subject.
by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 04:54:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]
lets be more cunning, get the river convicted of murder, then use that judgement as a precedent in the US courts

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.
by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:01:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If it murders an American, can it be extradited?
by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:03:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Dam! How do you terminate a river with extreme prejudice?

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:36:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Have they arrested the murderers of the Colorado River yet?

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:57:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I could sea it.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 07:24:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You are forbidden to snigger.

My sister-in-law was no doubt instrumental in negotiating this (she is a contractor, working on agreements between the Crown, i.e. NZ government, and the Maori tribes, governed by the Treaty of Waitangi, 1840)

What's more, we had a plan to canoe down the said river/person, with our respective spouses and children, last Christmas, but had to postpone it due to scheduling difficulties. We'll do it one day.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 05:26:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

thanks bill and melinda, and of course special praise to monsanto for this creativity

It's a fine line between homage, parody, and consumer opportunism. Jess Walter

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 06:43:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The End of Global Warming: How to Save the Earth in 2 Easy Steps | Noah Smith

You may not believe me, but I have news about global warming: Good news, and better news.
[...]
 A technology is in the pipeline that has the potential to eliminate CO2 emissions entirely. Solar power, long believed to be unworkably expensive, has actually been falling in cost at a steady exponential rate of 7 percent per year for the last three decades straight. Because of this "Moore's Law for solar", electricity from solar panels now costs less than twice as much as electricity from coal, and only about three times as much as electricity from gas. Furthermore, technologies now in the pipeline seem to ensure that the cost drop will continue.

Within the decade, solar could be cheaper than coal. Within two decades, cheaper than gas. When that happens, assuming we also have electric cars, it is game over for carbon emissions.



-----
sapere aude
by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 10:12:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
 LIVING ON THE PLANET 
 Society, Culture, History, Information 


The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:20:46 PM EST
How Mother Jones got the Romney `47 percent' story - The Washington Post

Big scoops come in small increments. It takes some luck and some connections, some phone calls and e-mails, and the time to build a relationship. Just ask David Corn.

Corn, the Washington bureau chief for Mother Jones magazine, on Monday wrote one of the most-talked-about stories of the 2012 presidential campaign about a video of Mitt Romney telling Republican donors at a May 17 fundraiser, among other things, that President Obama's supporters constitute the "47 percent" of the nation who are "dependent upon the government, who believe that they are victims."

Corn, 53, spent about four weeks coaxing the person who had surreptitiously shot the footage to hand over the full, undoctored video. It was recorded, apparently without Romney's knowledge and via an unknown device, at the fundraiser at the home of a wealthy private-equity investor in Boca Raton, Fla.

In the end, Corn said, getting the story came down to trust.

"It takes time and a number of conversations between two people," he said Tuesday, in one of a nearly nonstop series of interviews ("Dutch TV is waiting for me in my office!"). "As a journalist, you're always worried about losing a scoop, by the fear that [a source] is talking to 25 other people. But you have to give it time and let the relationship develop."



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:44:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Crews uncover massive Roman mosaic in southern Turkey

ScienceDaily (Sep. 18, 2012) -- A University of Nebraska-Lincoln archaeological team has uncovered a massive Roman mosaic in southern Turkey -- a meticulously crafted, 1,600-square-foot work of decorative handiwork built during the region's imperial zenith.

It's believed to be the largest mosaic of its type in the region and demonstrates the reach and cultural influence of the Roman Empire in the area in the third and fourth centuries A.D., said Michael Hoff, Hixson-Lied professor of art history at UNL and the director of the excavation.

"Its large size signals, in no small part, that the outward signs of the empire were very strong in this far-flung area," Hoff said. "We were surprised to have found a mosaic of such size and of such caliber in this region -- it's an area that had usually been off the radar screens of most ancient historians and archeologists, and suddenly this mosaic comes into view and causes us to change our focus about what we think (the region) was like in antiquity."

Since 2005, Hoff's team has been excavating the remains of the ancient city of Antiochia ad Cragum on the southern Turkish coast. Antiochus of Commagene, a client-king of Rome, founded the city in the middle of the first century.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:40:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Tissue-Engineered Leather Could be Mass-Produced by 2017: Scientific American

Things have been very hush-hush over at Modern Meadow since it was disclosed in August that the company had received funding from PayPal cofounder Peter Thiel's foundation to 3-D bioprint meat and leather.

But in an exclusive interview with Txchnologist, company cofounder and CEO Andras Forgacs has broken the silence and revealed some details about Modern Meadow's goals. Their first project? In vitro leather production.

"Our emphasis first is not on meat, it's on leather," Forgacs says. "The main reason is that, technically, skin is a simpler structure than meat, making it easier to produce."

The company also needs to acclimate potential customers to the idea of tissue-engineering products. It turns out that, initially at least, many consumers might not want to eat a modern technological marvel. "Anecdotally, we've found that around 40 percent of people would be willing to try cultured meat," he says. "There's much less controversy around using leather that doesn't involve killing animals."



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:53:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
CBS: Pacifiers may hinder males' emotional growth (19 September, 2012)
Three separate experiments - two with college-aged students and one with 6 to 7-year-old boys - revealed that those who reported using pacifiers found it harder to mimic emotional expressions or scored lower on emotional intelligence tests. The study is the first to connect pacifiers with psychological effects.

"That work got us thinking about critical periods of emotional development, like infancy," lead author Dr. Paula Niedenthal, a psychology professor at the University of Wisconsin in Madison, Wisc., said in the press release. "What if you always had something in your mouth that prevented you from mimicking and resonating with the facial expression of somebody?"

...

"By reflecting what another person is doing, you create some part of the feeling yourself," Niedenthal said. "That's one of the ways we understand what someone is feeling - especially if they seem angry, but they're saying they're not; or they're smiling, but the context isn't right for happiness."



I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:06:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]
no doubt imminent fisking, this looks pretty shaky to me.

Parents who are letting their 6 or 7 year old children have a pacifier have got some serious parenting issues, for a start. Probably correlates highly with watching more TV than the control group.

The only mildly interesting aspect is this :

Pacifiers may hinder males' emotional growth - HealthPop - CBS News

However, pacifier use did not seem to affect the girl's emotional results.

"What's impressive about this is the incredible consistency across those three studies in the pattern of data," Niedenthal said. "There's no effect of pacifier use on these outcomes for girls, and there's a detriment for boys with length of pacifier use



It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:18:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I didn't read that as the 6 and 7 year old - or the college students - using pacifiers at the time of the study. Though the writing is unclear.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:29:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I read it as children of 6 or 7 who did or did not use pacifiers as toddlers.

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:35:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That was my reading. Though now you're talking about parents recalling how much they allowed their kids use pacifiers. Unless they have a longitudinal study going for 20 years.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:38:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yeah, "self reported" is always tricky.


-----
sapere aude
by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:52:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Especially if there's stigma attached to something, and I think there's a mild stigma attached to prolonged dummy use.

Though that may be because I personally hate the things and never gave them to our two. Actually, I lie, we offered C one in desperation. He threw it at us.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Fri Sep 21st, 2012 at 06:49:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The correlation they found isn't totally implausible, and the fact that they've got two replications beside the first study is a good sign.

Of course, my nasty suspicious mind immediately suggests that the causality might go the other way: Boys with a predisposition for being poor at recognizing and responding to the emotions of those around them would probably be more difficult to make happy without the pacifiers. And the asymmetry between boys and girls in the study could, under that interpretation, be due to Y chromosomes being a (well known) risk factor for that sort of predispositions.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:51:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Next up: pacifiers cause autism!

I distribute. You re-distribute. He gives your hard-earned money to lazy scroungers. -- JakeS
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 10:10:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, girls in general getting more training in communication and expressing emotions through kindergarden and school is pretty well established. So maybe if there is an pacifier-correlation it is handled by training.

Press release:

"What if you always had something in your mouth that prevented you from mimicking and resonating with the facial expression of somebody?"

What if you could spit it out? Or make facial expressions despite having an object in your mouth? Does cigarett-smokers also get stunted emotions?

A vote for PES is a vote for EPP! A vote for EPP is a vote for PES! Support the coalition, vote EPP-PES in 2009!

by A swedish kind of death on Fri Sep 21st, 2012 at 06:40:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Interesting.

[...] the researchers believe when a baby has a pacifier in his or her mouth, they can't copy the expressions or emotions they are feeling. Similar experiences have been displayed in people who use Botox. Those who use the treatment report a smaller range of emotions and have a harder time labeling emotions on other people's faces.

Which explains Simon Cowell.

-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Thu Sep 20th, 2012 at 09:32:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
 PEOPLE AND KLATSCH 


The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:21:06 PM EST
1885: Birth of Ferdinand Joseph LaMothe (Jellyroll Morton), jazz early jazz musician.



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 12:52:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]
1984 - (d)  Steve Goodman, American folk music singer-songwriter (b. 1948)

An anticipated future in retrospect:



The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 19th, 2012 at 01:57:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]


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