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European Salon de News, Discussion et Klatsch - 4 September

by Nomad Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:31:34 PM EST

 A Daily Review Of International Online Media 


Europeans on this date in history:

1906 - birth of Max Delbrück, a German–American biophysicist who won the Nobel prize for the discovery that bacteria become resistant to viruses as a result of genetic mutations.

More here and here

 The European Salon is a daily selection of news items to which you are invited to contribute. Post links to news stories that interest you, or just your comments. Come in and join us!


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by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 03:07:01 PM EST
Borderline Europe criticizes EU border controls | Europe | DW.DE | 03.09.2012

Aid organization Borderline Europe has been honored with the 2012 Aachen Peace Prize for its criticism of what it calls the EU's harsh border control policies that leave the union with blood on its hands.

Refugees coming to Europe seem to top the headlines only when major tragedies strike - but the drama persists even when the coverage doesn't. For many years, people from Africa have made dangerous trips in inadequate vessels in an effort to seek refuge on European shores. And for many years, European authorities have tried to stop them. Aid organization Borderline Europe has been trying to give refugees a voice since 2007.

Coast guards in Italy, Greece, Spain and France are supported logistically and with personnel by the EU border protection agency Frontex. Their mission verges on the absurd. On the one hand, boats with refugees are to be turned around - using force if necessary - but, on the other hand, no person's life is to be endangered in the process. In fact, the border guards must offer help when migrants face visible dangers, whether caused by sickness or water or fuel shortages on board - or simply when a boat is so full that it could sink.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:10:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Germany Declines Comment on Report of Submarine Sale to Egypt - SPIEGEL ONLINE

The German government on Monday reaffirmed its commitment to Israel after media reports said relations between the two countries had been damaged by an unconfirmed deal to supply Egypt with two German-made submarines.

OAS_RICH('Middle2'); A German government spokesman declined to comment on an article which appeared in the Egyptian daily Al-Ahram last Friday and cited the commander-in-chief of the Egyptian navy, Osama al-Gindi, as saying: "We have agreed to a deal with Germany to procure two submarines of the latest 209 Class."

On Monday, Chancellor Angela Merkel's spokesman said only: "There has been no change in the German government's position towards Israel, in the commitment the German government feels towards Israel's security."

But he declined to comment on the supposed deal, saying the government maintained secrecy concerning matters dealt with by the Federal Security Council, a government committee that decides on sensitive weapons export deals.

Israeli newspaper Jediot Achronot reported on Sunday that ties between Israel and Germany had dramatically deteriorated because of the deal. The Israeli government declined to comment on Monday.

Class 209 submarines are built by the companies HDW and Nordseewerke. Germany has sold some 60 of those vessels to 12 nations.

Fears about Egypt Grow in Israel

Israel's relations with Egypt have deteriorated since Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak was toppled in February 2011. The Egyptian revolution has stirred fears in Israel that Egypt may undermine the peace treaty the two nations signed in 1979. According to Jediot Achronot newspaper, Israel is worried that its navy may fall behind if Egypt gets modern German submarines.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:10:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]
This of course in addition to the three comparable subs sold to Israel - bringing their total to six, and a prospective €10bn tank deal with Saudi Arabia.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman
by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:12:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
"The Lord's our shepherd says the Psalm
but just in case - we'd better get a bomb."

(Tom Lehrer, "Who's next?")


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sapere aude

by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 05:10:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Fur flies in Belarus's teddy bear wars - Europe - World - The Independent

In the past few weeks, the Belarusian dictator, Alexander Lukashenko, has fired the chief of his air force and border guard patrol; has shut down the Swedish Embassy in the country and kicked out the ambassador; and just last week fired his long-serving foreign minister. The reason? Teddy bears.

In early July, Tomas Mazetti, a marketing executive with the Swedish firm Studio Total, took off in a single- engine propeller plane from an airfield in Lithuania, donned a furry bear mask, and headed for Belarus. When his plane was inside the country, known as the last dictatorship in Europe, he released his cargo: several hundred teddy bears carrying slogans calling for democracy and increased freedom of expression. After nearly 90 minutes inside Belarusian airspace, he turned and headed back towards Lithuania, unmolested by the country's air defences.

Initially, the Belarus authorities denied it had ever happened, but when photographs started appearing on the internet, all hell broke loose. "Was this the stupidity of specific actors or systemic mistakes in the defence of the airspace?" Mr Lukashenko raged at a meeting of his security chiefs, demanding to know why the plane had not been shot down.

Perhaps the most disturbing victims of the teddy bear raid, however, are not the Swedish diplomats or Belarusian officials, but two locals who on the surface appear to have had very little to do with the Swedish stunt. Anton Suryapin, an ambitious 20-year-old photographer who had started his own news agency, was sent photographs of the teddy bears landing near a Belarusian village. He published the photos on his website, realising it was a journalistic coup.

There was lots of discussion online about the pictures, but nothing more happened for more than a week. Then on 13 July, the police and KGB, as the security services are still known in the country, arrived at his apartment.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:10:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Pirate Bay co-founder Gottfrid Svartholm Warg arrested in Cambodia | Technology | guardian.co.uk

A founder of the Pirate Bay filesharing website has been arrested in Cambodia at the request of Swedish police.

Gottfrid Svartholm Warg, 27, was detained in Phnom Penh by officers executing an international warrant issued against him in April after he did not turn up to serve a one-year jail sentence for copyright violations.

In Sweden, Warg's former defence lawyer Ola Salomonsson confirmed the arrest, according to the Aftonbladet website.

Warg and the site's co-founders - Fredrik Neij and Peter Sunde, and financier Carl Lundstroem - were convicted of encouraging copyright violations in 2009.

Neij, Sunde and Lundstroem all had their one-year jail terms reduced to between four and 10 months on appeal in 2010. They were also ordered to pay nearly $7m (£4.4m) in damages for copyright infringement to music and movie companies.

Warg did not appear at the appeal hearing, with his lawyer claiming he was too ill. The court upheld his sentence in his absence.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:12:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
EUobserver.com / Institutional Affairs / Barroso: EU Treaty 'needs to be renewed'

European Commission chief Jose Manuel Barroso has said EU institutions need more power over member states to fight the crisis.

Speaking on Saturday (1 September) in The Hague at a meeting of constitutional court judges organised by Yale University, he called for a "European renewal" and for a further "leap" of integration.

"We are experiencing a situation in which we need greater unity and coherence between our policies, as well as greater legislative harmonisation ... We need greater institutional integration. We need to consolidate a transnational order that through shared sovereignty guarantees the protection of our citizens," he said.

"The present crisis has shown the limits of individual action by nation states. Europe and the principles of the Treaty need to be renewed."

Barroso noted that deeper political union must come with "appropriate mechanisms of accountability" for Brussels.

But he blamed the EU's financial mess on profligacy by individual countries.

"If the member states do not in practice abide by the fundamental principles they have all agreed, then we are faced with a crisis of credibility," he said.

"While the immediate causes of the crisis currently affecting the European Union are indeed financial and economic, they are also, on a more fundamental level, the product of a crisis of values and of the non-respect of the norms," he added.

His remarks come at the start of the new political season after the summer break in Europe.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:12:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
IPS - AIDS Spreading Fast Across East Europe | Inter Press Service

Despite pledges from governments across Eastern Europe and Central Asia to fight HIV/AIDS - one of the eight Millennium Development Goals - the region has the world's fastest-growing HIV epidemic.

Punitive drug policies, discrimination and problems with access to medicines and important therapy are all driving an epidemic which is unlikely to be contained, world experts say, until governments in countries with the worst problems change key policies and approaches to the disease.

Daniel Wolfe, director of the International Harm Reduction Development Programme at the Open Society Foundations, told IPS: "In most post-Soviet countries, where HIV remains concentrated among injecting drug users, harsh policies and discrimination in healthcare settings continue to cripple the AIDS response."

Figures showing the extent of the region's problems with the disease make grim reading. According to the World Health Organisation (WHO), while HIV infection rates are actually falling globally, Eastern Europe and Central Asia (EECA) is seeing the reverse.

The WHO says that there were 170,000 new HIV infections in the region in 2011. New infections have risen 22 percent in the EECA since 2005, and there is no sign of a slowdown.

Injection drug use has been identified as fuelling the epidemic - accounting for up to 70 percent of new infections, according to the WHO.

Activists say the key to tackling the epidemic lies first and foremost in combating the injecting drug use problem, but that official and unofficial stances towards drugs and their users are stopping the problem being effectively tackled, or are even making it worse.

Dasha Ocheret of the Eurasian Harm Reduction Network, told IPS: "Punitive drug policies have to be stopped. People are afraid to get treatment for fear of criminal prosecution or problems with the police in other forms and there are situations where people would rather risk getting HIV than go somewhere like a needle exchange centre."

Russia and the Ukraine are widely seen as facing the greatest problems, with official policies in the former being blamed for hindering the fight against HIV/AIDS in other countries in the region too.

Opiate-substitution therapy (OST), a treatment for drug users in which methadone or buprenorphine are provided to heroin users, which is standard practice in much of the rest of the world, is banned by law in Russia. Public promotion of its use is punishable by jail.

Critics of methadone treatment in Russia argue that it keeps patients in addiction, while others claim western countries want the treatment offered in Russia for commercial gain. They also warn that methadone would probably end up being sold on the black market, sparking another drug problem.

But with Russia emerging in recent years as a major donor in the EECA region, it is also exporting its policies, including on OST, along with its money, and there are fears this could lead to OST programmes being shelved or restricted in other states.

"Russia is a serious regional player and its policy on drugs, like its policies on other drugs, influence policies in other countries in the region," said Ocheret.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:12:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Sweden 'helped US bomb Iraq in 2003': report - The Local
According to a report in the Expressen newspaper, which obtained previously classified documents from the US military's Central Command, a Swedish intelligence agency helped US war planners determine which targets to hit in a bombing raid to be carried out in March 2003.

Specifically, the US military was interested in learning more about Swedish-built bunkers in the Iraqi capital as the Pentagon suspected that one bunker, which was officially a safe room for civilians, may have also been used by the Iraqi military or the country's leaders.

The document explains that the US military obtained data about the bunkers through "intelligence exchanged with Sweden and the U.S.".

Last autumn, Expressen reported that high-ranking US military experts made a secret visit to Sweden in January/February 2003 to meet with officials from Swedish military intelligence agency MUST, reportedly to discuss the bunkers.

The revelations prompted a Swedish prosecutor to launch a preliminary investigation into whether a single employee with MUST gave secret information to the Americans.

However, the probe was shuttered after the prosecutor concluded that no espionage had taken place.

At the time of the Swedish-US intelligence cooperation detailed in the document, Sweden's Social Democrat-led government had pronounced its opposition to any invasion that wasn't sanctioned by the United Nations.

Following the March 20, 2003 bombing raid which marked the start of the Iraq War, then Swedish prime minister criticized the US-led invasion as "unfortunate".

"For starters, they acted without the support of the international community," he said the day after the attack, according to Expressen.
by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:16:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, the Swedish government's attitude at the moment was "Let's do whatever Washington wants. Now, now, no stopping to think about it!".


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sapere aude
by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 05:13:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Having read a reasonable selection of Scandanavian crime writers lately, the general sentiment seems to be that the Swedish intelligence service is a law unto itself.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 06:43:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes, and no.
Yes, in so far as there being too little oversight, and they can legally make people's lives difficult if they feel like it.
No, in that SÄPO et al are frequently considered blundering idiots.

(The 'Hamilton' books by Guillou, are about an aristocratic mass murdering secret agent who travels the world solving crime. Unlike his other books about an aristocratic mass murdering medieval knight.
Anyway, the book that mentions Bergling has an opening where the convicted spy, allowed a visit with family, outwits the police by going out the back door. Every Swede reading this nodded and said "yeah, pretty much".)

This could just be self deception, much like in England. (Not sure about Britain or the UK.)
As Bill Bailey said: "I'm English, and as such I crave disappointment."
Translation: "We may be incompetent, but we're not evil. It took Franco (Mussolini, Hitler ) to make the trains run on time yada yada."

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sapere aude

by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:51:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Recommend me some books. The Economist mentioned this recently...

http://www.economist.com/node/21561109

by asdf on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 01:51:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Eurointelligence Daily Briefing: Draghi defends legality of short-term bond purchases
ECB president says in a closed door session of the European Parliament that the ECB considers purchases of bonds with a maturity of up to 3 years as legal under its mandate; Draghi also laid out a plan to divide the job of bank regulation, not based on size but on functional grounds; Spain's deputy PM Soraya Saenz de Santamaria says it was now up to the ECB to save the euro; Draghi also strengthen the monetary transmissions argument, pointing out that the ECB cannot fulfil its price stability goals; the latest ECB data show that Spanish and Italian companies are paying much higher interest rates than German counterparts; Ewald Nowotny says this is not the time to worry about inflation: he is worried about a Japanese-style scenario instead; Markit has revised downwards the data for the eurozone's PMI for August; Frankfurter Allgemeine reports that Michel Barnier plans a separate proposals for a central bank recapitalisation and deposit insurance funds; the two may be merged; Wolfgang Schauble signalled readiness to compromise on bank regulation, but insisted that the ECB cannot supervise 6000 banks; Andalusia says it will apply for aid under Spain's rescue fund; the Valencian government has almost doubled its deficit forecast; Luis de Guindos says Spain would consider a rescue if the conditions are right; Italian car sales fall to lowest levels since 1964; the proportion of foreign holders of Italian bonds has dropped to 30%; In the Netherlands, Labour closes gap to anti-bailout Socialist party after television debates; Mark Rutte's party now leading in the polls; Troika officials are expected to reject planned cuts in defence and public administration in Greece; likely to ask for more pension cuts and lower minimum wages; two thirds of Austrians are against further bailouts according to a poll; an Austrian billionaire gets into politics with his call for abandoning the euro; Paul de Backer, meanwhile, reminds the Germans that they still owe Greece reparation payments; Paolo Manasse says it takes international coordination to solve the eurozone crisis; Claus Hulverscheidt, meanwhile, says the German government acts with duplicity by publicly endorsing the Bundesbank and privately endorsing Draghi.


If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:46:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Dutch Elections: Labour closes the gap to Socialists after television debates

Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte of the Liberal Party has widened his lead over Socialist Party leader Emile Roemer in the run up to an election on September 12 that has been dominated by the euro zone crisis, two surveys showed on Monday. The latest Maurice de Hond and Ipsos Synovate opinion polls showed the Liberal Party in the lead, while the Labour Party has made gains at the expense of the Socialists, largely reflecting the stronger performance of Rutte and the new leader of the Labour Party, Diederik Samsom, in televised election debates.  According to both polls Rutte's party would win 35 seats in the 150-seat parliament, while the Socialist Party is either on second place (29 seats) according to the de Hond poll or third place (24 seats)  in the other poll. Labour gained and closed the gap to Socialists in the first poll and even outperformed them (30 seats)  in the Ipsos Synovate poll. With no single party set to win more than about a quarter of the seats in parliament, the Netherlands faces the prospect of months of coalition talks and political uncertainty, writes Reuters.



If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 04:11:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
EU Observer: Bulgaria shelves euro membership plans
Speaking in an interview with the Wall Street Journal on Monday (3 September) in Sofia, Prime Minister Boyko Borisov and Finance Minister Simeon Djankov said the decision was the result of the debt crisis and the double dip recession facing the eurozone, along with rising public opposition to joining the single currency.

...

Bulgaria already fulfills the economic criteria to join the euro, having reduced its budget deficit to 2.1 percent in 2011, comfortably below the 3 percent limit laid out in the Stability and Growth Pact.

The country, whose 17.5 percent debt burden is also one of the lowest in the EU, has pegged its Lev currency to a currency basket including the euro but is not in ERM II, a formal EU mechanism for limiting currency fluctuation. Countries must spend at least two years in ERM II before joining the euro.



If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 04:23:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Kleine Zeitung [AT]: Drohende Pleite: Jansa warnt vor dem "Diktat der Troika" (03.09.2012)
Und dann appellierte er an die traditionell tief sitzende Angst seiner Landsleute vor Fremdbestimmung, was einem nationalen Trauma gleichkäme: "Und glauben Sie mir, jede slowenische Regierung wird immer noch viel sozialer sein als das mildeste Diktat der Troika." Schon vor Wochen hatte Janša den Druck auf die Opposition erhöht, indem er eine Vertrauensabstimmung im Parlament ankündigte. Da aber selbst in Janšas Fünf-Parteien-Koalition Streit herrscht, hat er seine Drohung zunächst nicht wahr gemacht und auf diesen Herbst verschoben.
Imminent bankruptcy: Jansa warns about the "Troika's diktat" (03.09.2012)
And then [Slovenian PN Janez Jansa] eppealed to his compatrits' traditionally deep-seated fear foreign rule, which is a national trauma: "and believe me, any Slovenian government will be much more social than the mildest diktak from the Troika." Already weeks ago Janša had increased pressure on the opposition, by threatening a confidence motion in Parliament. But stife reigns also in Janša's onw five-party coalitionm and so he hasn't made good on his threat and postponed it to the Autumn.


If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 05:03:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 03:08:43 PM EST
French jobless tops three million, minister says - FRANCE - FRANCE 24

The number of French unemployed has broken through the 3-million barrier for the first time since 1999, the country's leaders say.

The latest total adds pressure on President Francois Hollande, whose administration is under attack for doing not doing enough to fix the economy. France's unemployment rate is currently 10 percent.

Breaking the 3 million mark carries more symbolic importance than economic but it was covered extensively in the French media over the weekend. The Ministry of Employment says the 3-million threshold was crossed in 1996 and again in 1999.

Employment Minister Michel Sapin confirmed the total on French radio on Sunday and warned that the numbers would likely get worse. Prime Minister Jean-Marc Ayrault called the numbers "very violent". The government announced last week that it had counted more than 2.9 million unemployed people in July, so the threshold was expected to be passed in August.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:19:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Two-thirds of French pessimistic about future under François Hollande | World news | guardian.co.uk

A new Socialist president and a freshly appointed leftwing government have not made the French especially happy, according to a poll that found two-thirds are pessimistic about the future.

In the latest of a series of surveys carried out three months after François Hollande won office, 68% of those asked said they were worried for themselves and their family.

The level of Gallic gloominess comes close to the all-time high - or low - recorded in 2005 shortly after Jacques Chirac was elected for a second term in office, when the pessimism was shared by 70% of people. Hollande's predecessor as president, the right-of-centre Nicolas Sarkozy, made only 50% of French people fearful for the future.

Dimanche Ouest France, the newspaper that commissioned the survey, said 2005 was a "historic peak of measured pessimism" and that those with the most bleak outlook were those over 65 years old, small businessmen and women and the unemployed. The most cheerful, it declared, were labourers. "It's the first time that concern is so high at the start of a presidential mandate," the pollsters Ifop reported.

It is not only opposition voters who see dark clouds ahead: 58% of Socialist party supporters said they had found little comfort in having the left in power for the first time in 15 years.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:20:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, whilst Hollande isn't Sarkozy, he's still supporting the implementation of neoconservative policies. And that's the root cause of the problem

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:11:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]
EUobserver.com / Economic Affairs / ECB under pressure on bond-buying

Pressure is mounting on the European Central Bank (ECB) ahead of a key meeting on Thursday (6 September), when it is expected to shed more light on a controversial bond-buying plan aimed at helping Spain and Italy.

"The ECB is the bazooka, the firepower, the muscle, the one that has the capacity to impress upon the markets," said Angel Gurria, a Mexican economist chairing the Paris-based Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development - a club of the world's most developed economies.

Asked by newswires whether the ECB should buy Italian and Spanish bonds in order to lower their borrowing costs, he said: "Yes, they should. If you ask when, the answer is the sooner the better."

Burria spoke on the sidelines of a conference in Slovenia's lakeside resort of Bled on Sunday.

"We have passed the question of moral hazard, these are performing countries [in terms of reforms], now it is the system that is at stake," he added.

Despite support from several leading economists, the bond-buying move still lacks backing from the ECB's most influential member - the German Bundesbank.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:25:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Trichet: Bond buying program may be 'justified' - CNN.com

A bond-buying program to rescue debt-ridden European nations could be "justified" to counter dysfunctional markets, Jean-Claude Trichet, former European Central Bank president, has told CNN.

Trichet's comments came as investors brace themselves amid speculation that current European Central Bank President Mario Draghi will hint at sovereign bond purchases of fiscally-frail countries such as Spain in an attempt to ease the euro crisis.

Trichet said: "I don't want, myself, to add to any anticipation. This is the job of the governing council. A number of things have been said and we will see what is decided."

He added "I would say when you embark on non-standard measures... It seems to me that it is justified... You have to counter markets that are not functioning correctly and are hampering the transmission of the monetary policy.

"It also gives time to the other partners, which are not only the governments and their policies, but also the private sector."

The ECB is currently locked in a stalemate with the Spanish government over providing support. Draghi wants the eurozone's fourth-biggest economy to formally request aid from the European Financial Stability Facility, the eurozone's temporary bailout fund, and commit to a program of structural reforms before stepping in.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:26:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Draghi, the one true statesman | Presseurop (English)

On 6 September, the European Central Bank President is expected to announce that his institution will attempt to resolve the Eurozone crisis by buring Spanish and Italian debt. Notwithstanding German opposition to this decision, Le Monde argues that it has the merit of defining a way forward for Europe.

This week, the President of the ECB should end the debate on bond purchases when he unveils the roadmap of the European Central Bank.  In his standoff with the Bundesbank, Mario Draghi has used all his authority to save the single currency.  And he has distinguished himself by his fervour.  

On the euro front, the autumn rentrée into political activities following the summer holidays has a name, and just one: Mario Draghi. The man will not swerve, we can be sure, from that elegantly crooked smile and courtesy that is his way of showing calm and serenity in heavy weather. Now, more than ever, the future of the single currency is in the hands of the President of the European Central Bank (ECB). It is rather reassuring. This Italian is a true European - and, these days, that species is very rare indeed among the leaders of the EU countries.

Last week in the German weekly Die Zeit M. Draghi declared that he was ready to take "extraordinary measures" to save the euro. Clearly, the ECB will resume a program to buy Treasury bonds to come to the aid of the two major EU countries that are finding it hardest to get financing on the markets, Spain and Italy.

He's right. Madrid and Rome have taken courageous decisions to tackle some of the deep pathologies affecting them, and Italians and Spaniards are paying a high price for these plans for drastic fiscal consolidation and structural reforms. The financial markets, however, taking little notice, are continuing to demand exorbitant interest rates on government bonds from these countries.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:27:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Is this the same guy who declared the "European social model" dead six months ago?
So what does he want to save?


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sapere aude
by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 05:19:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
BBC News - Andalusia requests 1bn euros from Spanish government

Spain's Andalusia has become the latest region to request a financial lifeline from the central government.

The region had asked for 1bn euros (£791m) worth of aid to be granted immediately, said Susana Diaz, a senior politician from the region.

She said that Andalusia was following in the footsteps of other regions and made the request for an advance "because we need liquidity".

Valencia, Murcia and Catalonia have requested bailouts in recent weeks.

Last week, Valencia said it would ask for 4.5bn euros in bailout money, more than had been suggested when it first made the plea earlier this summer. Debt-ridden Catalonia has asked for a bailout of 5bn euros, while Murcia has said it will need 300m euros.

A 18bn-euro public fund was set up by Madrid to aid its 17 autonomous regions, which are in deep debt.

The conditions which the Spanish government will impose on loans from the fund have not yet been announced.

But Mario Jimenez, the spokesman for the Socialist Party (PSOE) in Andalusia's left-leaning coalition government, warned against trying to impose a "corralito", which refers to capital controls and harks back to Argentina a decade ago, when its government froze bank accounts in order to prevent bank runs.

"What shouldn't happen is to run the financing of the autonomous communities like a corralito," he said.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:28:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Andalucía seeks €1bn lifeline from Spanish government | Business | The Guardian

Andalucía, Spain's most populous region, has said it needs a €1bn (£800m) advance to pay its bills.

It comes as Catalonia, the second most populous region, warned that if it does not get rescue money by the end of the month, it will be in serious trouble and must seek a bridging loan.

The Spanish government has yet to make available the €18bn rescue fund to provide liquidity to regional governments that cannot fund themselves. The regions account for 40% of Spanish public spending and the queue of those needing money urgently is getting longer.

Catalonia has asked for €5bn from the rescue fund to cover debt-rollovers and deficit spending this year. Regional finance boss Andrea Mas-Colell has warned it may have to apply yet another round of spending cuts before the end of the year.

The Standard & Poor's credit rating agency downgraded Catalonia's debt to junk status at the weekend. The Catalan government claims it is being picked on, especially as S&P claimed its attempts to change its financing deal with Madrid would add to tensions.

Catalonia's nationalist government wants the region to become like the Basque country and gather taxes itself before sending Madrid its share, rather than the other way around, with central government collecting taxes and then sending Catalonia its part.

Meanwhile Spain's economy minister said on Monday the country's ailing banks will probably not need all the €100bn that has been made available by the country's euro partners.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:28:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Bulgaria Shelves Plans to Join Euro - WSJ.com

Bulgaria, the European Union's poorest member state and a rare fiscal bright spot for the bloc, has indefinitely frozen long-held plans to adopt the single currency, marking the latest fiscally prudent country to cool its enthusiasm for the embattled currency.

Speaking in interviews in Sofia, Prime Minister Boyko Borisov and Finance Minister Simeon Djankov said that the decision to shelve plans to join the currency area, a longtime strategic aim of successive governments in the former communist state, came in response to deteriorating economic conditions and rising uncertainty over the prospects of the bloc, alongside a decisive shift of public opinion in Bulgaria, which is entering its third year of an austerity program.

"The momentum has shifted in our thinking and among the public...Right now, I don't see any benefits of entering the euro zone, only costs," Mr. Djankov said. "The public rightly wants to know who would we have to bailout when we join? It's too risky for us and it's also not certain what the rules are and what are they likely to be in one year or two," Mr. Djankov said.

Bulgaria's move to freeze accession plans comes as Europe's debt crisis has caused other fiscally prudent European nations to back away from adopting the currency. Lithuania's Prime Minister Andrius Kubilius last week said that his country would only join the common currency when "Europe was ready," signaling that his government had tempered its previous enthusiasm. That followed a statement from Latvian Prime Minister Valdis Dombrovskis that his government would decide on a euro-adoption timetable in the spring of 2013, contrasting with a previous pledge to join in 2014.

Bulgaria has won plaudits for successfully reducing its budget deficit to 2.1% of gross domestic product in 2011 by slashing wages and pensions. The economy is stabilized by a currency board that pegs the currency, the lev, to the euro and forces the government to hew to tight policy.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:55:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Euro-Zone Manufacturers Struggling - WSJ.com

Activity in euro-zone factories fell further in August as new orders dwindled, suggesting the outlook for the 17-nation economy remains poor, a survey of purchasing executives showed Monday.

The decrease in manufacturing activity was less steep in August than in July, but still marks a 13th month of contraction that will drag on the economy overall in the third quarter.

Data company Markit said the manufacturing Purchasing Managers' Index for the 17 nations that use the euro rose to 45.1 in August from 44 in July. The latest reading remains below the 50 break-even level, indicating a drop in activity compared with July.

While the pace of decline slowed in Europe's largest economy, Germany, as well as in France, new orders for German exports suffered their steepest retreat in over three years, underscoring the vulnerability of its economy to global stagnation.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:57:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Loan rates point to eurozone fractures - FT.com

Interest rates paid by companies in the eurozone's weaker economies have surged, highlighting the bloc's fragmentation as the European Central Bank loses control of borrowing costs.

ECB data on Monday showed Spanish small businesses face the highest bank borrowing costs in almost four years - while interest rates paid by German rivals are at record lows.

High quality global journalism requires investment. Please share this article with others using the link below, do not cut & paste the article. See our Ts&Cs and Copyright Policy for more detail. Email ftsales.support@ft.com to buy additional rights. http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/60ae47cc-f5e5-11e1-a6c2-00144feabdc0.html#ixzz25RVCgSoA

The sharply diverging interest rates have put southern European companies increasingly at a competitive disadvantage to their northern European rivals.

They provide a gloomy backdrop to this week's ECB governing council meeting, which will discuss plans for intervening in eurozone government debt markets, as investors price in the chance of a break-up of the 14-year old monetary union.

David Riley, head of sovereign ratings at Fitch Ratings, said: "The fragmentation is getting worse. If this trend gains even greater momentum we'll face a fundamental reordering of the eurozone. It undercuts the whole rationale of the euro, and could eventually make it easier for it to break up."

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:58:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Economics and Politics by Paul Krugman - The Conscience of a Liberal - NYTimes.com

In a lot of ways George Osborne, the Chancellor of the Exchequer (finance minister) is Britain's answer to Paul Ryan. True, he's a toned-down version -- no Ayn Rand, please, we're British -- but other aspects of package are there in full force: he's articulate, has a vision that's completely at odds with everything we actually know about macroeconomics, and he was for a while the darling not just of the right but of self-proclaimed centrists on both sides of the Atlantic.

Osborne's big idea was that Britain should turn to fiscal austerity now now now, even though the economy remained deeply depressed; it would all work out, he insisted, because the confidence fairy would come to the rescue. Never mind those whining Keynesians who said that premature austerity would send Britain into a double-dip recession.

Strange to say, Britain's recovery stalled soon after Cameron/Osborne began their new policies, and the country is now in a double-dip recession.

So is Cameron rethinking his faith in Osborne? According to the FT, no:

But Mr Osborne continues to enjoy David Cameron's backing and will stay as chancellor when the prime minister this week conducts his reshuffle, expected to take place on Tuesday.

Instead of a real policy rethink, what Cameron and Osborne apparently have in mind is rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic a set of basically minor twiddles involving credit and planning authorizations, which seem highly unlikely to make any significant difference.

Still, there is criticism from within the Tory party -- except what the dissidents want is not a return to conventional macro, but "right-wing shock therapy".

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:02:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If only the Labour party offered an alternative, but Ed Balls believes in the same bullshit as Osborne

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:17:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]
We can't grow ourselves out of debt, no matter what the Federal Reserve does | Charles Eisenstein, The Guardian - Comment is Free
Let's replace our fixation on growth with a steady-state economy focusing on lower consumption, leisure and ecological health

... our present money system can only function in a growing economy. Money is created as interest-bearing debt: it only comes into being when someone promises to pay back even more of it. Therefore, there is always more debt than there is money. In a growth economy that is not a problem, because new money (and new debt) is constantly lent into existence so that existing debt can be repaid. But when growth slows, good lending opportunities become scarce. Indebtedness rises faster than income, debt service becomes more difficult, bankruptcies and layoffs rise.

Central banks used to have a solution for that. ...

<...>

... what if quantitative easing were combined with debt forgiveness? The banks get bailout after bailout - what about the rest of us? The Fed could purchase student loans, mortgages or consumer debt and, by fiat, reduce interest rates on those loans to zero, or even reduce principal. That would liberate millions from the debt chase, while freeing up purchasing power for those who are truly underconsuming.

More radically, central banks should be allowed to breach the "zero lower bound" that has rendered monetary policy impotent today. If investors are unwilling to lend even when risk-free return on investment is 0%, why not reduce that to -2%, even -5%? Implemented as a liquidity tax on bank reserves, it would allow credit to circulate in the absence of economic growth, forming the monetary foundation of a steady-state economy where leisure and ecological health grow instead of consumption.

One thing is clear: we are at the end of an era. No one seriously believes that we will grow ourselves out of debt again. There is an alternative. It is time to begin the transition to a steady-state economy.



Point n'est besoin d'espérer pour entreprendre, ni de réussir pour persévérer. - Charles le Téméraire
by marco (cowannar at gmail punkt com) on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 07:27:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]
There is nothing wrong with a monetary system which requires nominal growth that a healthy 6-7 % annual dose of inflation will not solve for you.

Negative interest rates, meanwhile, are a non-fix to a non-problem: They encourage people to use cash instead of electronic transfers (which incurs real costs in many ways), or force you to go full Gesellian currency (which incurs other sorts of costs in many other ways). All that fuss and bother for an intervention which doesn't do anything for you that activist fiscal policy won't do better.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 08:55:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Money creation and debt creation are two separate processes that can be decoupled from each other at will.  There may be reasons to do so, or not to do so, in particular times and places, but they are not inseparable.
by Zwackus on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 11:38:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Did you mean to have a "not" in the first sentence, or am I misreading the second one?


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sapere aude
by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 05:25:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I think you are misreading the second one.  You can create money, and you can create debt.  You can do both at the same time and pretend that one enables the other, but you don't have to.

The government creates money every time it writes anyone a check, and it destroys money when it collects taxes.  The creation of Treasury Bonds is an entirely separate process.

by Zwackus on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 06:51:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
OK, thanks for clarifying. I see what you mean now.

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sapere aude
by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:52:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Not to say that a leisure-based steady state economy is necessarily a bad thing . . . it actually sounds like a pretty good thing.  But you don't get there through monetary policy.
by Zwackus on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 11:39:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The banks get bailout after bailout - what about the rest of us?

Screw you, if you're not wealthy/powerful. Who do you think is running/ruining this show? Get real.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wp4O7v5320

by THE Twank (yatta blah blah @ blah.com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:41:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 03:08:46 PM EST
.:Middle East Online::Arab Gulf states lash out at Syrian regime :.

Arab Gulf monarchies lambasted Syria's regime for deploying heavy weapons against its civilians, as more than 100 people were killed in raids, bombings and air strikes, according to a watchdog toll count.

As the violence raged, new international peace envoy Lakhdar Brahimi said change in Syria was "unavoidable", although he carefully refrained from calling for President Bashar al-Assad to step down, as his predecessor Kofi Annan had.

Speaking to the BBC, the former Algerian foreign minister admitted that his new mission was "nearly impossible".

He said he was "scared of the weight of responsibility. People are already saying people are dying and what are you doing?"

Jihad Makdissi, a spokesman for Assad's embattled government, announced Brahimi would "soon" travel to Damascus, expressing confidence that "he will listen to us".

The Syrian Observatory for Human Rights said more than 20 people were killed in an army offensive on Al-Fan village in Hama province, one of the main arenas of conflict in the more than 17-month uprising.

The Britain-based watchdog had no details on whether those killed were civilians or rebel fighters, "but all 21 of the dead were men", said its director Rami Abdel Rahman.

Horrific images shot and posted on YouTube by activists in Al-Fan showed a long row of bodies shrouded in white cloths, laid out on the ground surrounded by scores of weeping men, women and children.

State news agency SANA said all of those killed during the Al-Fan clashes were from "an armed terrorist group that was attacking citizens and security forces".

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:44:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Air strikes take toll on Syrian civilians - FT.com

In a border town in north-east Lebanon where a group of Syrian refugees are sheltering, a little girl in dirty clothes points nervously to the sky as an aeroplane passes over. "The children are scared of planes," explains one of the men.

In the last month, the regime of Bashar al Assad has increasingly resorted to air strikes in opposition areas, a strategy that has raised the death toll and exacerbated an already serious humanitarian crisis as thousands of people flee their homes in search of safety.

"In the past we knew how to hide from tank bombing - but airplanes see us wherever we are," says one woman in Lebanon who recently fled her home in central Syria after it was destroyed by an air strike. Like other refugees, she did not want her name to be published.

The first reports of the use of fighter jets emerged in late July in the economic and commercial centre of Aleppo in northern Syria, where the regime has been battling a surge in rebel fighting, but activists say air strikes are now being used countrywide.

Human Rights Watch, the international NGO, has received credible reports of aerial attacks in the Damascus area, the northern province of Idlib, the southern province of Deraa, the central provinces of Homs and Hama and the eastern province of Deir Ezzor.

It is difficult to identify precise patterns in the regime's bombardment of opposition areas, which include the use of artillery, mortars and rockets, says Ole Solvang, a researcher with the group. But aerial attacks by helicopters and fighter aircraft are becoming "more and more" frequent in the Aleppo province, and sometimes involve bombs, he says. In one incident in the town of Azaz near the Turkish border in August, "22 houses were completely turned in to rubble by a single aerial attack", said Mr Solvang.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 04:54:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
IPS - Libyan Weapons Arming Regional Conflicts | Inter Press Service

In the aftermath of Libya's revolution, Libyan fighters and weapons are flooding areas of conflict in neighbouring countries, according to local fighters and officials in several countries.

Libya's still heavily armed militias continue to sell their weapons on the black market directly to foreign militias from war-ridden countries, or to arms-dealers from third countries who then sell them on to warring factions, they say.

"All of the militias are involved in selling weapons. There is no law in Libya, still no functioning government, and the country's security forces are too weak to control the situation, so selling weapons is regarded as legal by many of the rebels," said Ridwan, a former rebel who fought with Tripoli's Suq Al Jumma Katiba (brigades).

"Many of the fighters got greedy following the war and believe they are entitled to compensation for the sacrifices they made for their country as they believe the government has abandoned them," Ridwan, who did not give his last name, told IPS.

"The guys sell an AK-47 on the black market for 1,000 Libyan dinars (800 dollars). An anti-aircraft gun mounted on the back of a pickup truck goes for between 8000-10,000 LD. Most of the weapons are smuggled to the borders, especially Turkey."

Libyan Islamist fighters are also reported to have swollen the ranks of the Free Syrian Army (FSA) in their fight against Syrian President Bashar Al Assad's security forces.

The presence of Islamic extremists in North Africa's greater Sahel region, bordered by Algeria, Burkina Faso, Mauritania and Niger, has contributed to destabilising the area.

Tuareg rebels have declared their own state, Azawad, in the northern part of Mali, which has also been invaded by Ansar Dine, an Islamist group that works closely with an organisation known as Al-Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb (AQIM). The Tuareg are an indegenous people in the Saharan region.

As fighting rages on in Mali, reportedly supplemented by Libyan weapons, a number of foreigners have been kidnapped.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:06:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]
IPS - Israel `Pillaging' Palestinian Resources | Inter Press Service

By mining natural resources from the occupied Palestinian territories for its own economic purposes, Israel is committing the war crime of pillage in the Dead Sea area, according to a report released Monday by Palestinian human rights group Al Haq.

"Israel is openly in violation of its obligations as an Occupying Power in the (occupied Palestinian territories), because it is encouraging and facilitating the exploitation of Palestinian natural resources and actively assisting their pillaging by private actors," said the Al Haq report, titled `Pillage of the Dead Sea: Israel's Unlawful Exploitation of Natural Resources in the Occupied Palestinian Territory'.

Criminal responsibility for the crime of pillage does not only extend to the state of Israel, but can also be applied to individuals, namely Israeli settlers who benefit from the extraction of resources from the Dead Sea, Al Haq said.

"Although settlers and companies involved in the exploitation of the natural resources of the Dead Sea are mainly encouraged to do so by the State of Israel, they cannot ignore that such resources are considered Palestinian under international law. This should be sufficient to substantiate the `mental element' of the crime of pillage, thus allowing for some Israeli settlers to be considered as the direct perpetrators of that crime," the report stated.

Israel has maintained that numerous covenants of international humanitarian law do not apply to the occupied Palestinian territories since these areas are not under Israel's jurisdiction. Recently, an Israeli government-appointed committee, known as the Levy Committee, also ruled that Israel is not an occupying power and that therefore, Israeli settlements in the West Bank are legal.

Nonetheless, many international jurists have maintained that Israel is violating basic principles of international law in its occupation of the Palestinian territories and exploitation of the area's resources. Article 47 of the Hague Convention (1907), which outlines war crimes under international humanitarian law, states that "pillage is formally forbidden."

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:07:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]
South Africa frees first batch of miners - Africa - Al Jazeera English

South Africa has released the first of 270 miners detained more than two weeks ago after police shot dead 34 of their colleagues in a bid to break up a wildcat strike at Lonmin's Marikana platinum mine.

"The murder charges against the accused are at this point of time withdrawn," Magistrate Esau Bodigelo said on Monday as he released dozens of miners in the court in Ga-Rankuwa near Pretoria.

"You may stand down," he added as applause broke out in the courtroom.

The men were charged last week under an obscure apartheid-era security law with murdering their fellow miners, despite video of the incident clearly showing it was police who fired on the strikers.

State prosecutors provisionally withdrew the murder charges at the weekend following a public outcry.

The releases are being processed in batches with no bail required but the group will return to court on February 12 next year on charges of public violence and for holding an illegal gathering.

"They [the freed miners] were really joyous when they left the court, a sense of triumph even if it is a very small triumph," Al Jazeera's Tania Page reported from Ga-Rankuwa on Monday.

"It vindicates them that they were allowed free after there was such an outcry against that murder charge laid against them by the National Prosecuting Authority."

Although the murder and attempted murder charges were dropped for all 270 arrested miners, not all of them were released on Monday. Police said addresses had to be verified as a condition for their release.

"We were expecting 140 men to walk free from this court on Monday, we didn't see that," our correspondent said. "We think it was about 50 or 60, but we understand that on Thursday the remainder of that 270 will walk free from this court as well."

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:09:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Poor in India Starve as Politicians Steal $14.5 Billion of Food - Bloomberg
Ram Kishen, 52, half-blind and half- starved, holds in his gnarled hands the reason for his hunger: a tattered card entitling him to subsidized rations that now serves as a symbol of India's biggest food heist.

Kishen has had nothing from the village shop for 15 months. Yet 20 minutes' drive from Satnapur, past bone-dry fields and tiny hamlets where children with distended bellies play, a government storage facility five football fields long bulges with wheat and rice. By law, those 57,000 tons of food are meant for Kishen and the 105 other households in Satnapur with ration books. They're meant for some of the 350 million families living below India's poverty line of 50 cents a day.

Instead, as much as $14.5 billion in food was looted by corrupt politicians and their criminal syndicates over the past decade in Kishen's home state of Uttar Pradesh alone, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. The theft blunted the country's only weapon against widespread starvation -- a five-decade-old public distribution system that has failed to deliver record harvests to the plates of India's hungriest.

"This is the most mean-spirited, ruthlessly executed corruption because it hits the poorest and most vulnerable in society," said Naresh Saxena, who, as a commissioner to the nation's Supreme Court, monitors hunger-based programs across the country. "What I find even more shocking is the lack of willingness in trying to stop it."

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:10:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Why should they stop it ? They're making money and absolutely nobody is gonna do anything about it. It's like Italy and bulgaria, the crime syndicates own the politicians

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:22:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Oh, man, I was deluding myself into thinking Indian politicians were different. Not corrupt and self-serving like the one's we have in the West, and Africa and China.

(Not just being snarky. It really seemed for a while they had things going well. Must have been reading the wrong things.)


-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 05:29:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I've never really understood the consensus which made India one of the rapidly growing economies. It has always been obvious to me that it is too corrupt while the infrastructure it has is already inadequate and, given the corruption and bureaucracy, there is absolutely no way the country is capable of upgrading it sufficiently to ever be anything that a wasted opportunity.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 06:40:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It does appear to be too large a country to rule by anything resembling democratic means.
At least I'm not aware of a precedent.


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sapere aude
by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:55:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I think churchill had a saying about democracy being the worst political system, apart from all the other ones.

However, I think that, as the US demonstrates every so often, the larger the democracy, the more stringent the checks and balances need to be. India has gone unchecked for 50 years and it's a mess

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 08:00:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Mitt Romney exited Bain Capital with rare tax benefits in retirement - The Washington Post

Before Mitt Romney retired from Bain Capital, the enormously profitable investment firm he founded, he made sure to lock in his gains, both realized and expected, for years to come.

He did so, in part, the way millions of other Americans do -- with the tax benefits of an individual retirement account. But he was able to turbocharge the impact of those advantages and other tax breaks in his severance package from Bain in a way that few but the country's super-rich can ever hope to do.

As a result, his IRA could be worth as much as $87 million, according to his estimates, and he can continue to earn tax-advantaged income from Bain more than a decade after he formally left the firm.

The Republican presidential nominee has been "scrupulous" about observing the tax code, said Romney campaign spokeswoman Michele Davis. "His income is reported and taxed in full compliance with U.S. law, and he has paid 100 percent of what he has owed." She added that the financial holdings of Romney and his wife, Ann, are managed by a blind trust the Romneys do not control.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:10:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Mitt Romney's wealth in spotlight again after tax probe - Americas - World - The Independent

The source of Mitt Romney's personal wealth continues to generate awkward headlines after it emerged that regulators have subpoenaed Bain Capital, the private equity firm he once headed, during an investigation into its tax arrangements.

New York's Attorney General, Eric Schneiderman, is seeking internal documents that will establish whether Bain - along with 11 other firms - has been forgoing management fees in favour of investments in the funds which they manage. Investments are taxed at a far lower rate than ordinary income.

The practice falls into a legal grey area. Some lawyers consider it an aggressive but legitimate means of tax avoidance; others believe it strays beyond the bounds of legality. Bain Capital is believed to have used it to avoid paying around $220m (£138m) in taxes, according to The New York Times, which broke news of the subpoena at the weekend.

Mr Romney left Bain over a decade ago, but continues to profit handsomely from his ties to the firm, and in the past two years earned roughly $13m from his share of its profits. A spokesman yesterday insisted the tax strategy at the centre of Mr Schniederman's probe is "a totally legal practice".

Mr Romney's financial arrangements have been an electoral talking point for months. The Republican candidate, believed to be worth upwards of $250m, continues to ignore calls to follow the protocol followed by almost every modern predecessor by releasing up to a decade's worth of his federal tax returns.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:11:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Don't Go to the U.S., A Foolish and Backward Nation | Anonymous via Tea Leaf Nation
... a tongue-in-cheek critique of Americans has gone viral on Sina Weibo, China's Twitter, with over 42,000 retweets and 5,400 comments.

I've already been in the U.S. for a long time. I regret that choice. We've been [fooled] by Western media the whole time, making us think that the U.S. is a modernized country. Harboring hopes of studying American modern science in order to serve my motherland, I moved heaven and earth in order to make it over to this "superpower." But the result has been very disappointing!

(1) The U.S. is actually a giant, undeveloped farming village. ...

(2) Americans don't understand economics. ...

(3) American construction is too primitive. ...

(4) Americans' thinking is naive and backwards. ...

(5) Americans don't understand [how to eat] game. ...

(6) Americans don't understand self respect. ...

(7) American elementary school students don't have lofty ideals. ...

(8) Americans cause a big ruckus every time they see a little illness. ...

(9) American public opinion is nuts. ...

(10) Americans are spiritually empty. ...

(11) Americans do not have a concept of time. ...

(12) American stores make no sense: You can return something weeks after buying it without even giving a reason. ...

(13) The U.S. isn't safe. ...

(14) Americans are wimps. ...

(15) Americans lack emotion. ...

(16) Americans aren't sensible. ...

(17) Looking at the above photo, it's enough reason for us to look down on the Americans! ...



Point n'est besoin d'espérer pour entreprendre, ni de réussir pour persévérer. - Charles le Téméraire
by marco (cowannar at gmail punkt com) on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 07:35:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I agree with (4), (9), (13), (14), and (16).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wp4O7v5320
by THE Twank (yatta blah blah @ blah.com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:46:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Pointless America bashing.

"American elementary school students don't have lofty ideals." <eye roll>

by asdf on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 02:16:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ha ha, I think you missed the irony in the piece!

Point n'est besoin d'espérer pour entreprendre, ni de réussir pour persévérer. - Charles le Téméraire
by marco (cowannar at gmail punkt com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 11:13:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Palestinian Zionism | Ha'aretz
Anyone who wants to see what irreversibility looks like should head to Jerusalem. The Arab residents of East Jerusalem have long continued to see themselves as part of the Palestinian community of the West Bank, even though they are officially Israeli residents and are entitled to vote in municipal (but not national ) elections. But that appears to be starting to change.

Take the East Jerusalem Palestinians who aspire to an "Israeli" education. They no longer wish to make do with Palestinian matriculation certificates that keep them out of Israeli jobs, and they don't want to wait in line at a roadblock to attend Palestinian institutes of higher learning. They would prefer to earn an Israeli matriculation certificate and attend the Hebrew University of Jerusalem.

[...]

If the theory of Israelization is correct, the next step for Arabs living in East Jerusalem should be immersion in local politics. So far, they have largely refused to vote in Israeli municipal elections, as a way of making a statement about their distinct identity. Their lack of governmental representation has made it easier for the city, and the country as a whole, to discriminate against them when it comes to apportioning slices of the budget.

[...]

A united Palestinian ticket (if there were to be one ) could, based on population data, win between 10 and 13 of the 31 seats on the city council. There are even some pundits who think it is possible, even if unlikely, that as long as the Jewish vote continues to be split along religious lines and the city's Arabs succeed in remaining united enough to field only one ticket, the next mayor of the Israeli capital could be a Palestinian from East Jerusalem.

Isn't a similar Palestinian split along religious lines more plausible along with a Haredi-Islamist coalition?
by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:44:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Oudeh Basharat in Ha'aretz
At the time of writing these lines, the sun continues to shine and even though the Muslim Brotherhood is in power in Egypt, the country has not been cloaked in darkness. It was not out of excessive love of secularism that Egyptian President Mohammed Morsi declared in Tehran that Egypt is a modern, constitutional democracy. Egypt has not adapted itself to the Brotherhood, it is the Brotherhood that has adapted itself to Egypt, which is known as "Umm al-Dunya," the mother of the world.

And at a time when the emissary of the prime minister of the only democracy in the Middle East - National Security Adviser Yaakov Amidror - was busy requesting the blessing of Rabbi Ovadia Yosef to bomb the Iranian nuclear project, Cairo was filled with demonstrators demanding that the Brotherhood movement be dispersed. Democracy works in strange ways.

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:48:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]
by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 03:08:52 PM EST
Wildlife at risk as Amazon tribes come under threat from oil exploration | Environment | guardian.co.uk

Two of the world's last uncontacted tribes are under threat from oil exploration deep into the heart of the Amazon forest in Ecuador, according to conservationists, who say this may indirectly add to the pressure on wildlife.

The Tagaeri and the Taromenane - who have fought off illegal loggers and Catholic missionaries with spears and blowpipes to maintain their isolated, nomadic existence - are now at risk from the construction of roads and drilling wells as petroleum firms carve up the Yasuni national park.

Scientists believe Yasuni is the most biodiverse place on Earth and large swaths of the park remain in pristine condition thanks partly to the ferocity of the indigenous people's resistance to intruders.

That is changing. Although the rights of these tribes are recognised by the country's constitution, their existence has been largely ignored by government authorities responsible for drawing up the boundaries for development, say researchers who have studied their interaction with often-violent and lawless frontiers of globalisation.

The Taromenane - known locally as the "red feet" - are thought to be offshoots of the Huaorani, who speak the same language but have suffered a very different fate. The Huaorani - which means "human being" - also used to be almost entirely carnivorous nomads and fearsome defenders of their rainforest home. They resisted contact until 1958, but now most are settled, often around oil well communities with whom they have a parasitic relationship.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:13:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]
REACH chemical law 'worth the money in the end', says BASF | EurActiv

BASF, the German chemical giant, has distanced itself from the rest of the industry by saying Europe's REACH chemical safety law was worth the investment in the end. A review of the legislation is expected this month.

From the moment it was tabled until its eventual adoption in 2006, the REACH regulation gave rise to one of the most epic lobbying battles in the EU's history.

The bitter campaign saw chemical companies warn they could be forced to close factories and leave Europe because of the extra costs generated by the EU law, which sought to protect consumer health and the environment.

These included widely publicised industry studies which claimed that REACH would cost billions of euros to implement, causing millions of job losses in Germany.

"BASF was possibly the single most important player in influencing politicians and in leading the industry lobby against the environmental and health objectives of REACH," said Jorgo Riss, from the Greenpeace European Unit in a paper recalling the REACH lobbying saga.

BASF U-turn on REACH

Six years on, the European Commission is preparing to launch a review of the controversial legislation.

But BASF has now radically changed its communications strategy.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:15:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Grape growers fight to keep planting limits | EurActiv

Grape growers are lining up support from EU national governments and the European Parliament to protect limits on vine planting that are due to expire by 2016, a liberalisation move they claim will destroy one of Europe's premier industries.

The planting debate is gaining momentum as a high-level group organised by Agriculture Commissioner Dacian Cioloş searches for a compromise and lawmakers weigh amendments to the EU's common market organisation, or CMO, that for years has allowed government intervention to support and stabilise grape growing.

Backed by national governments in major wine producing countries, vintners are pressuring Parliament and national leaders to reverse a four-year-old decision to lift restrictions which, unlike production quotas, limit how many vines can be planted. Though the planting rules  are due to expire in 2016, national governments can maintain restrictions for two additional years.

Stéphane Le Foll, France's agriculture minister, said last week he had lined up the support of the German, Italian and Spanish governments to defend planting rights, EurActiv France reported.

Agricultural organisations say ending planting restrictions could further weaken a sector that is already battling cheap imports, overproduction and declining demand for a glass of wine. Land under cultivation in the EU fell 12% from 2001 to 2011, International Organisation of Vine and Wine figures show.

`Rural exodus'

They also say those bucolic landscapes covered in vineyards have add-on effects - tourism and rural preservation - that Europe can ill afford to lose. The debate is also full of emotion - the regional wine growers association, AREV, adopted a resolution in May defending planting rights, calling vine cultivation one of the "

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:15:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm with the southern wine growers. If you add sugar to it, it shouldn't be called wine

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:27:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Tigers take the night shift to coexist with people
Tigers aren't known for being accommodating, but a new study in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences indicates that the carnivores in Nepal are taking the night shift to better coexist with humans.

The revelation that tigers and people are sharing exactly the same space -- the same roads and trails -- of Chitwan National Park flies in the face of long-held convictions in conservation circles. It also underscores how successful conservation efforts need sciences that takes into account both nature and humans.

"As our planet becomes more crowded, we need to find creative solutions that consider both human and natural systems," said Jianguo "Jack" Liu, the director of the Center for Systems Integration and Sustainability at Michigan State University. "Sustainability can be achieved if we have a good understanding of the complicated connections between both worlds. We've found something very interesting is happening in Nepal that holds promise for both humans and nature to thrive."

Conventional conservation wisdom is that tigers need plenty of people-free space, which often leads to people being relocated or their access to resources compromised to make way for tigers.

Neil Carter, MSU doctoral student and one of the paper's co-authors, spent two seasons setting motion-detecting camera traps. His analysis of the images shows that people and tigers are walking the same paths, albeit at different times.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:15:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ingrid Newkirk: Top Scientific Minds Declare That We Are Just One Among Many Animals

in the just-released Cambridge Declaration on Consciousness, witnessed by Stephen Hawking, a prominent group of scientists has declared that humans are not unique in ways that matter. Says the panel, "Non-human animals, including all mammals and birds, and many other creatures, including octopuses, also possess these [same] neurological substrates [as human beings]." Yes, they stand on their toes or tentacles, snatch their offspring from their arms or their arboreal nests, and they feel the same way about it as would you or I. The question is, how is this knowledge to inform our behavior? After all, shouldn't it?

Of course, hundreds of studies have already demonstrated animals' logical, mathematical, linguistic, and emotional intelligence. For example, for years we blithely believed that humans were the only species to use tools, until researchers documented that wasps were using pebbles as hammers, octopuses were carrying coconut shells as portable hiding places, crows were using sticks to dig in the ground for grubs and many other examples. The mathematical abilities of fish have proved to be on a par with those of monkeys, dolphins and bright young human children.

We know that elephants flirt with each other and gather to grieve over the loss of a loved one, that cows shed tears, and that monkeys have refused to pull a chain to access their only source of food if doing so caused another monkey, even a stranger, to experience a painful electric shock. In that famous study, one monkey starved and went without water for nearly two weeks to avoid hurting his fellow. When the experiment was repeated, other monkeys also chose to starve rather than giving shocks to another monkey. A similar study done with human subjects showed that 65 percent of people continued to give other people increasingly strong electric shocks if an experimenter simply told them to do so. It's not the monkeys who need their heads examined!



It's a fine line between homage, parody, and consumer opportunism. Jess Walter
by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 09:08:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Scientific community drifting towards Buddhism...
by asdf on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 02:17:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Just drifting away from Abrahamic prejudice.

If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 02:32:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]
enlightenment in the west means freedom from religious oppression, in buddhism it's supreme liberation from endless cycles of samskara, birth and death, possible food for thought...

It's a fine line between homage, parody, and consumer opportunism. Jess Walter
by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sat Sep 8th, 2012 at 04:03:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]
HEALTHBEAT: Is organic healthier? Study says not so much but it's key reason consumers buy - The Washington Post

Patient after patient asked: Is eating organic food, which costs more, really better for me?

Unsure, Stanford University doctors dug through reams of research to find out -- and concluded there's little evidence that going organic is much healthier, citing only a few differences involving pesticides and antibiotics.

Eating organic fruits and vegetables can lower exposure to pesticides, including for children -- but the amount measured from conventionally grown produce was within safety limits, the researchers reported Monday.

Nor did the organic foods prove more nutritious.

"I was absolutely surprised," said Dr. Dena Bravata, a senior research affiliate at Stanford and long-time internist who began the analysis because so many of her patients asked if they should switch.

"There are many reasons why someone might choose organic foods over conventional foods," from environmental concerns to taste preferences, Bravata stressed. But when it comes to individual health, "there isn't much difference."

by Nomad on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 02:00:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Bullshit, the nutrition is beside the point, it's the absence of agro-chemical industrial residues that's the bonus

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:30:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Isn't that basically what the article says (lower down, where most people probably miss it)?
Her team did find a notable difference with antibiotic-resistant germs, a public health concern because they are harder to treat if they cause food poisoning.

Specialists long have said that organic or not, the chances of bacterial contamination of food are the same, and Monday's analysis agreed. But when bacteria did lurk in chicken or pork, germs in the non-organic meats had a 33 percent higher risk of being resistant to multiple antibiotics, the researchers reported Monday in the journal Annals of Internal Medicine.

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:34:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
but the amount measured from conventionally grown produce was within safety limits

By definition that isn't the point. You don't mean to say that you lack trust in the "safety limits"?

by Katrin on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:39:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm not sure if this guy is serious:
The Green Chain: Prop. 37 doesn't go far enough
(This is Proposition 37 which is being voted on in California in November, "Should Genetically Modified food be clearly labelled".)

I do agree that you shouldn't get a free pass from labelling just because you say you are "organic".

-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 06:07:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The article looks to me like some fairly underhanded argumentation, particularly with the repetition of "Big organic", which seems to have become a talking point in this California prop debate, also with the insistence on "cancer-producing toxic chemicals produced by plants" which would be a good reason for not eating fruit and veg whether organic or not.

What needs clearing up (and this article doesn't help), is that it's not

Number 6:

just because you say you are "organic"

but there is an organic label which presupposes conformity to specifications that are inspected by a certification organism. In other words, it's not just an empty marketing claim. And, normally, organic specs eschew GMOs.

What the (immeasurably bigger-than-organic) conventional food industry doesn't want is to have to inform consumers when a product contains GMOs. Arguing that there are lots of other things that could be indicated on packaging is to confuse the issue.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:18:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
All good points.

Yes, it reads a bit like what you get with Creationism and Climate change denial: try every possible argument and see what sticks.


-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 08:01:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I knew it would tickle people here.

Still, as I've been dabbling with the subject this year, this is in my perspective the scientific consensus as it now is converging, though this list is far from inclusive:

  • organically grown vegetables and fruit don't have significantly different nutrient levels and don't have any obviously observed health benefits than non-organic products;
  • they do come more often with lower residues of pesticides in general (though not always absent), but both organic and non-organic remain below the safety limits;
  • whether those safety limits are questionable is hardly a point of immediate concern in studies, or I can't find them;
  • I can't find anything on the long-term effects of biological pesticides either;
  • organically produced meat products have lower antibiotic-resistant bacteria (duh);
  • measuring taste experiences is a scientific mess and severely tampered by psychological effects and public perceptions;
  • most, though not all, organically grown crops take up more arable land than conventionally grown products;
  • regularly, studies show that conventionally produced meat and vegetables products have a lower footprint; though in many one-on-one comparisons are skewed, because the systems are not yet comparable.

Go on, shoot.
by Nomad on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 05:24:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Nomad:
conventionally produced meat and vegetables products have a lower footprint

What does "conventionally produced" mean? And what do you mean by "footprint"?

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 05:35:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Scratch too much at those words, and worlds with ten dimensions open.

If that's your point, I agree.

by Nomad on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 06:37:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]
They are actually questions, not a point.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:19:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, since Nomad's not interested in discussion, I will answer for him.

"Conventionally produced" means "produced using unnatural means".

"Footprint" means "environmental impact, including or excluding whichever externalities suit my argument".

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:33:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
"Conventionally produced" means "produced using unnatural means".

You mean they get to break the laws of physics?

Everything is "natural." Just because something comes out of a factory does not make it "not natural." The question is not "natural/not natural." The question is harmful/not harmful, of which an important parameter is sustainable/not sustainable.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 09:13:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, I am happy to use all sorts of manufactured articles : synthetic clothes, smart phones, automobiles, etc. But I am conservative about the things I introduce into my body. It's too delicate and poorly-understood to be messed with more than strictly necessary. I would make an exception for nylon valves or titanium screws should it prove necessary, but I'm not keen on designer organisms, petrochemically-derived molecules designed for their toxicity to plants or animals, nanoparticles of any sort, non-exhaustive list.

As a rule of thumb, anything which would not be familiar or comprehensible to a farmer of 100 years ago is suspect. That's not to say that farming was just fine 100 years ago; but most of the systemic health problems associated with farming in that era have been ironed out, whereas we lack the necessary perspective on the innovations of recent decades.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 09:41:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Nomad:
the scientific consensus as it now is converging

The majority of "science" on the subject is and has been funded and run by the agri/chemicals/food industries and the official instances that are entirely linked with them in terms of public policy, such as the agriculture ministries of producer countries and their subordinate institutions.

"Converging consensus" is a leading term -- leading precisely in the direction the Goliaths in the field want us to go.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 05:48:46 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If we cannot agree on what constitutes "evidence"...

If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 05:49:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That is in fact the measure of the problem.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 06:02:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Good thing we figured that out after 4 comments and not 400. We can now move on.

If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:07:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I suggest that any scientific approach to the question would call, not for a review of the literature as in "he said, she said", but a critical review of what studies have been done, what questions posed, what value can be ascribed to the data, what the financing was.

This is not because "organic farming" is in some way special. Entire fields (in food/chemicals/drugs) are muddied by corporate research programmes and manipulation of public regulatory bodies.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:32:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If I don't follow scientific consensus on climate science, I'm a sceptic or a  'denialist' but clearly inherently up to no good and most likely funded by the oil-industry.

Yet if I don't follow scientific consensus on studying aspects of our global food system...

If the yard sticks can't match up, all fails. What rests is philosophy and quibbles.

I can't do much else than use the tools I'm given. Which is scientific analysis.

afew:

The majority of "science" on the subject is and has been funded and run by the agri/chemicals/food industries and the official instances that are entirely linked with them in terms of public policy, such as the agriculture ministries of producer countries and their subordinate institutions.

Oh, I've heard all that. And I'm more than willing to listen. Here is the hard part: Citation needed.

by Nomad on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 06:30:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Put it this way: if you consider the science you have been looking at to be independent, and neutral in the sense that studies have been carried out fairly evenly by both "sides", then <citation needed>.

Yes, it's the hard part.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:37:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Whch side should the burden of proof be on?

If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 08:19:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If a physicist conceives of a hypothesis and constructs a set of experiments to test it, it seems reasonable to talk of the "burden of proof".

Things are less clear-cut in this case. If one considers that the "organics" are saying "organic food is superior for reasons X or Y", while the "chemicals" are saying "conventional food is fine as it is", then there's a burden of proof on each.

Unfortunately, studies take place in an unclear zone where the choice of samples matters as much as (if not more than) the exactitude of the measurements. And in a context where the financial means to carry out studies is disproportionately weighted to the "chemicals" side.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 09:15:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, from a statistical/experimental design point of view, the "null hypothesis" in this case would be "there is no difference between the two methods". The onus would then be on the claimants that "organic is different" (let alone "better") to prove that "alternative hypothesis".

If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 09:19:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm pointing out that this issue exists in a context that allows for little pure academic scientific design. In the real world, your null hypothesis, however technically correct, is massively tilted in favour of the corporations that also have far more means to fund studies.

I'm not saying there should be another null hypothesis: I'm saying theory doesn't apply here. This is or should be the domain of public regulatory policy, and just as pharmaceutical corps are supposed to prove the innocuity of their products before bringing them to market, or REACH demands that chemicals be guaranteed harmless (according to current research), so (mutatis mutandis) onus should be placed on the food industry (including organic) to show its products do not harm consumers. That opens a wider field (unhealthy fats and sugars, for example) than just agricultural methods, but pesticides and antibiotic-resistant bacteria should surely be covered.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 09:54:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Your first and second points flat-out contradict each other. "Safety limits" are a cultural construct, not a scientific reality, as is demonstrated by their constant revision downwards in developed countries (i.e. previously allowed products are forbidden; previously acceptable levels are lowered).

Good luck with finding studies of long-term adverse effects of biological pesticides. Hints : 1) By construction they are used because they are alleged to have none. Contrast this with chemical pesticides, which are alleged to have negligeable adverse effects, which remains true only if we neglect them. 2) If widely-used biological pesticides had adverse effects, chemical agribusiness would have sponsored scientific studies to demonstrate it.

Your point about land use is, I think, a red herring. it's a case-by-case thing : what is the constraining resource in each case? In Europe and North America, I don't see a shortage of arable land. In Europe, minor displacement of lower-value crops by higher-value crops may occur, but there is a huge buffer of pasture which may be pressed into service (and almost any crop is going to be an order of magnitude more efficient than meat production).

Your "footprint" question might be valid if you could come up with a way of accounting for the difference in non-renewable inputs (notably petroleum and petrochemical) between organic and non-organic agriculture, in a systematic way. Good luck with that.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 06:02:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You have a fine way posing hard questions.

Your first and second points flat-out contradict each other.

Of course not. I wrote "don't have any obviously observed negative effects". Unless you want to argue that gathering the evidence for detrimental health effects caused by long-term exposure to slightly raised pesticide levels (but below the levels that are considered safe by governmental health bodies) is obvious. In that case, point me the way to the scientists involved. I'd love to talk to them.

Good luck with finding studies of long-term adverse effects of biological pesticides.

I'm not looking for studies of long-term adverse effects of biological pesticides. I'm looking for studies of long-term effects of biological pesticides. There's a difference.

Particularly in comparison to conventional pesticides, the use of biological pesticides is still marginal - but they are slowly marching on. I would find it baffling that there would be no scientific studies into them - just because they are alleged to have no adverse effects.

Anyway, I know for a fact that they are being studied - otherwise they would not be allowed on the European market.

Your point about land use is, I think, a red herring. it's a case-by-case thing : what is the constraining resource in each case?

Red-herring? You make it sound like I'm in an argument. I'm not arguing, I  list what I've come across so far.

And the most extensive studies conclude that much organic grown product take up more land in comparison.

I'm entirely agnostic on whether this aspect should be considered a problem (be it for increased land use, food shortage or other) or a benefit.

Your "footprint" question might be valid if you could come up with a way of accounting for the difference in non-renewable inputs (notably petroleum and petrochemical) between organic and non-organic agriculture, in a systematic way. Good luck with that.

I pointed out myself that most of the comparisons are skewed and the systems are not comparable, but thanks for the vote of confidence in my own analysis...

Onwards...

by Nomad on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 08:39:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
My experience of scientific method applied to complex real-world phenomena is that it takes decades, even centuries, to recognise the bleedin' obvious. This is often preceded by decades of vehement denial of phenomena which are accepted as part of the normal order of things by those who adopt a non-scientific but holistic world view. You can't test a scientific hypothesis that you can't define the parameters of; so you end up evaluating side-issues.

I revere scientific method as a touchstone of collective intelligence, and I am appalled and frustrated when people (notably journalists) extrapolate limited results to attempt to explain big, simple questions.

The authors of the review of literature that you cite seem to have had an intelligent approach, but found very little subject matter on the more interesting points :
HEALTHBEAT: Is organic healthier? Study says not so much but it's key reason consumers buy - The Washington Post

The Stanford team combed through thousands of studies to analyze the 237 that most rigorously compared organic and conventional foods. Bravata was dismayed that just 17 compared how people fared eating either diet while the rest investigated properties of the foods themselves.

Health outcomes are the most interesting issued, but are poorly studied. Well, duh. Agribusiness isn't interested in those particular issues.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 04:05:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
My experience of scientific method applied to complex real-world phenomena is that it takes decades, even centuries, to recognise the bleedin' obvious.

No, what takes decades is separating the bleeding obvious but false, from the bleeding obvious and true.

Bleeding being, ironically, an excellent example.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 06:52:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Jake nailed the essence. I think ATinNM has plenty useful things to say about dabbling in understanding non-linear, complex systems - let alone explaining the findings.

But to add: frequently enough the non-scientific worldview turned out to be hopelessly wrong. Following a non-scientific but holistic worldview, like any other worldview, has all the risks of becoming nothing more than sophistry or faith-based arguing - which have often enough hindered the path of scientific reasoning.

Findings answers (or 'truth') by relying on a non-scientific approach, or insisting on the (very real) drawbacks of the scientific methods, renders practically every scientific finding null and void. As I wrote before, what remains is philosophy and quibbles. Interesting for some, not for me.

Now, a hard and difficult scientific question that afew and you and many others throw up (based on... ??) when another meta-analysis passes by: how dependent is the total sum of findings compared to science studies that rely on funding which is dominated by Big Agro actors?

That answer could be: science funded by Big Agro significantly alters the signal of the total of science findings. But there also is a realistic chance the answer is that even despite the dominance of Big Agro funding, some findings are reliable enough and don't match with dominantly held personal worldviews.

So, who will start crowd-funding?

by Nomad on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 11:06:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Like most who trust science, you underestimate the influence of framing and rhetoric.

The point is that there is a difference between disinterested and approximately objective science, and bought-and-paid-for 'research' used as rhetoric.

The public don't trust science because some scientists are paid to lie. The poster child for this is the tobacco industry which spent a literal fortune 'sponsoring' (i.e. buying) 'research' that proved smoking was safe. Or if not entirely safe, not actually that dangerous. Or if quite dangerous, not actually addictive.

And so on.

There are also numerous pharmaceutical 'studies' that turn out to be fraudulent and misleading.

So is this study honest and objective, or is fraudulent, corrupt and misleading? How can anyone tell?

How can you tell?

In any case, is it asking the right questions? The issue around organics isn't nominal nutritional benefit - a potato is mostly just starch, after all - but long-term sustainability and an absence of damage to critical eco-systems.

What effects do pesticides have on - say - bee colonies? On farm run-off and freshwater systems?

How does organic farming compare?  

Those are the questions that matter, and this study doesn't ask them. Instead it frames the question as a consumer lifestyle choice, which is barely the point at all.

Science works fine when you're looking for something like the Higgs boson. But when you have commercial interests involved, it's empirically provable that what's happening often isn't real science at all.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 11:56:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Two things in response.

Yes, there is bought-and-paid-for 'research' and yes, there are merchants of doubts. This is an important point, but I'm far from persuaded that it is the point. I don't doubt the impact on rhetoric, public and politics.

Except that science history is riddled with uphill struggles, and it's equally empirically provable that science findings do come out on top.

In my geology years I've studied the history of how the world got rid of the poison that is leaded petrol. It is a terrific, heroic (and sadly obscure) tale about the chemist who also was the first in precisely dating the absolute age of the earth.

The counterpoint is that despite colossal commercial interests involved, the general public is largely aware that smoking is not safe for one's health, tetraethyllead is being phased out and that acid rain has retreated by regulating sulfur emissions.

Secondly, you are not the first in grumbling that this study does not answer the 'right' questions (for you). And I don't contest that the unknowns are insignificant or unimportant. I also haven't studied them enough and haven't written about them - yet.

But for a topic as fundamental as food, the question of nutrition and the relation of human health remains relevant to study. A minor quibble, I don't see the recent science article framing the question of food nutrition as merely 'a consumer lifestyle choice'. Perhaps through the lenses of media outlets, but not in the science article. Point me where you see that.

by Nomad on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 04:55:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm not talking about finding answers using a non-scientific approach. I'm simply pointing out that, not only does science often fail to deliver answers in a timely manner, but that many people will deny simple realities which haven't been "proven by science".

For my part, my approach to what I eat, and to what I feed my children, is informed mostly by my own thinking, experience, observation, trial and error etc. For example, I started drinking raw milk because I could get it more easily (from a neighbour) than sterilized milk; I later learned that there are health benefits, some well-accepted, others controversial. Sourcing foods locally, with as little processing as possible, turns out to have all kinds of benefits. Some of these are undoubtedly nutritional. I'm far from certain that it could be scientifically  proved, but I'm relaxed about that.  Organic or not is a small but significant part of this.

I am sure that I (and my children) have better health, and better eating habits, because of this approach.

Insofar as it's important in the struggle for mindshare about how we eat, I would welcome more scientific research about the comparative health merits for the consumer of shorter vs longer food supply chains, for example. But it's hard to see how you get standardized data to compare.

The problem with agribusiness is that their interest is to assign the lowest possible value, both economic and ontological, to the "raw material" of the human food supply : the actual fruit, vegetable, cereal, animal : and to extract the maximum added value when transforming it (so, the more transformations the better) before selling it in a standardised form to the consumer.

So : a potato is a potato is a potato. Don't ask where it came from. It doesn't matter. Now it's a "large fries" in a cardboard wrapper. Science has proven that it's good for you.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:24:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]
For example, I started drinking raw milk because I could get it more easily (from a neighbour) than sterilized milk; I later learned that there are health benefits, some well-accepted, others controversial.

I should greatly like to see evidence of such benefits. Because from what I've seen, unpasteurized milk is pretty much pure downside.

There's a loud, obnoxious contingent of raw foodies who claim otherwise, of course. But they're fronted largely by people I know for a fact are quacks and charlatans.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 05:58:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It turns out that the science on the benefits is pretty much settled, though vested interests are fighting rearguard actions :

Kids who drink raw milk have less asthma, allergies | Reuters

Although earlier studies have found less asthma and allergies among kids who drink raw milk, the new work is the first to point to the exact components in the milk that might be protective.

Loss and his colleagues tapped into a large survey in which parents answered questions about their children's milk consumption. The researchers also collected 800 milk samples from the participants' households.

Compared with kids who only drank store-bought milk, those who drank raw milk had a 41-percent reduction in their odds of developing asthma. They were also only about half as likely to develop hay fever -- even after accounting for other factors that might be relevant.

Of course, you can catch stuff from raw milk. Tuberculosis, for example, if the cow has tuberculosis. E.Coli infections, if the farmer mixes cowshit with his milk.

Dairy farmers in Europe are subject to rigorous hygiene testing. A lot of the milk is used, unpasteurised, to make cheese (you can't make a very interesting cheese with pasteurised milk, because it kills most of the flora).

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 07:13:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The thing I noticed about that study is that the asthma and hay fever outcomes were self-reported, and that the proposed correlation between whey proteins and health outcomes disappeared when regressed against antigen counts.

An interesting paper, yes, but not persuasive enough that I'd feed anybody I knew unpasteurized milk.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 09:27:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The thing I noticed about that study is that the asthma and hay fever outcomes were self-reported

I'm not sure where you're getting this...

The protective effect of farm milk consumption on childhood asthma and atopy: The GABRIELA study

Health outcomes were assessed according to International Study of Asthma and Allergies in Childhood standards.12 Childhood asthma was defined as either wheeze in the past 12 months, asthma inhaler use ever, or a doctor's diagnosis of asthma at least once or wheezy bronchitis more than once. Current asthma was defined as childhood asthma and wheeze in the past 12 months. Hay fever required occurrence of nasal symptoms with itchy or watery eyes in the past 12 months or a doctor's diagnosis of hay fever ever. Atopic dermatitis was defined as a doctor's diagnosis ever.

Children exclusively drinking farm milk as reported in the phase II questionnaire had significantly lower odds ratios for asthma, current asthma, atopy, and hay fever compared with children exclusively drinking shop milk (Table III). The association with atopic dermatitis was of borderline significance. Mixed milk consumption (consumption of both shop and farm milk) was protective for hay fever and atopy. Consumption of any unboiled farm milk was consistently inversely associated with asthma, hay fever, and atopy in both exclusive and mixed farm milk drinkers. Early exposure and daily consumption of farm milk showed a stronger inverse association with health outcomes in mixed milk drinkers. Because most exclusive farm milk drinkers were exposed to farm milk early in life with daily consumption, the power to detect the influence of frequency and age of first farm milk exposure was limited. Consumption of only boiled farm milk was not associated with any health outcome.

Anyway, thanks for playing. Your response is a nice illustration of the thinking and methods of the "science-only" crowd : start with denial and denigration, then when faced with conclusive evidence, resort to obfuscation.

As far as I can guess, your "self-reported" line would seem to be designed to lead the non-diligent reader to believe that the raw-milk drinkers are the "loud, obnoxious contingent of raw foodies" you mention above (who might be, you know, under-reporting asthma and allergies), whereas you and I know that they are largely farm-dwelling populations in southern Germany, Switzerland, Austria, and Poland.

the proposed correlation between whey proteins and health outcomes disappeared when regressed against antigen counts

I can't find anything about this in the study, nor any discussion of antigens. Can you help me?

An interesting paper, yes, but not persuasive enough that I'd feed anybody I knew unpasteurized milk.

Fine, you are entitled to be afraid of bacteria. I take it you never eat raw-milk cheese?

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 10:54:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]
From the section Key messages

Higher levels of the whey proteins BSA, α-lactalbumin, and β-lactoglobulin in milk samples were associated with a reduced risk of asthma but not atopy.

In other words, for the health outcome where they used their own measurements of objective indicators, they could not document a correlation between the outcome and the postulated causal agent. Whereas in the outcomes where they did observe that correlation, they relied upon the condition being correctly identified and diagnosed by third parties who may or may not have uniform screening and type two error rates.

Since test and control groups are drawn from different demographics, this is almost certain to be a confounder. And I cannot see where they attempt to correct for that.

Now, this is not because it is impossible, or even very expensive, to measure respiratory function or the degree of respiratory distress - that is routinely done in trials of asthma medicine. So it baffles me that they didn't take such measurements.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 11:50:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
They have demonstrated a correlation between whey proteins and (asthma/people who lie about asthma), pick one. They have demonstrated a correlation between raw milk and both atopy and hay fever, without identifying any specific causal agent.

So we've got it down to "raw milk has health benefits, but maybe they're lying about the asthma".

The association between farm milk consumption and asthma presented here was independent of and adjusted for farming and only partially attenuated the farming effect on asthma, as previously observed.

If I'm reading this correctly, the positive effect of raw milk on reported asthma applies to both farming and non-farming demographics.  I hope those straws you're clutching don't give you hayfever.

Now, this is not because it is impossible, or even very expensive, to measure respiratory function or the degree of respiratory distress

Sample size of ten thousand. Sounds expensive to me.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 12:39:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]
They have demonstrated a correlation between whey proteins and (asthma/people who lie about asthma), pick one.

No, I don't have to. There can be a variety of reasons for not getting asthma diagnosed. To take a very simple example, the physical symptoms of asthma come on a sliding scale, and the point on that scale where you go from "normal" to "ill" is a social construct which can and does vary between demographics. Which means that the same underlying distribution of physical symptoms can and does give you different number of diagnoses in different populations.

Then there's attention to and knowledge of the disease, and the extent of routine screening programs - when you look for the disease, you find more of it than when you don't look for it. A truism, but an important confounder that they do not seem to have considered.

They have demonstrated a correlation between raw milk and both atopy and hay fever, without identifying any specific causal agent.

The hay fever diagnosis wasn't based on standardized measurements, so any comment applicable to the asthma diagnosis is equally applicable to the hay fever diagnosis.

And you should always be very careful about fishing for correlations without having a plausible causal model in mind. That's an awfully good way to generate type I errors. In this case, the causal story they wanted to tell did not pan out for the one correlation where they actually measured both input and output. In the other correlations they report there are obvious confounders on input or output (inclusive or), which they do not appear to have taken steps to analyze.

If I'm reading this correctly, the positive effect of raw milk on reported asthma applies to both farming and non-farming demographics.

If it's a screening, diagnosis and reporting effect, then you need to control for a lot more demographic indicators than just farming/non-farming.

Sample size of ten thousand. Sounds expensive to me.

So trade some sample size for standardized endpoint measurements. Particularly since the samples are heavily imbalanced (the control group is much larger than the treatment group) which means that the marginal contribution by the control group to the statistical power of the test is small.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 07:36:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Nomad:
Eating organic fruits and vegetables can lower exposure to pesticides, including for children -- but the amount measured from conventionally grown produce was within safety limits, the researchers reported Monday.

such weaselry... do lobbies affect regulation and so-called safety limits?

any measure of accumulated pesticides, or just a number for each serving?

today someone said to me that the reason all this PR about the uselessness of eating organic is because we can't afford to have too many people choose organic. why not, i thought,, with all the unemployed, it shouldn't be a problem with manpower.

i think it's more that vested interests make too much money off the status quo.

it's not all about us anyway, more the planet we leave the future generations, and respect for animal welfare, raising the species' awareness of the karmic consequences of so much blood and pain being the 'normal' price of nutrition.

it's mostly about the planet, the water wastage, and the inhumanity to animals, including wildlife killed by pesticide and fert runoff.

farms now are dangerous for people to be around, toxic dumps. not so long ago they were the symbolic epitome of health. what changed that?

the chemicals industry.

the extra price on organics is health insurance for you and the planet, 'nuff said.

It's a fine line between homage, parody, and consumer opportunism. Jess Walter

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 04:03:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Interesting quotes from the article :

germs in the non-organic meats had a 33 percent higher risk of being resistant to multiple antibiotics, the researchers reported Monday in the journal Annals of Internal Medicine.

Organic produce had a 30 percent lower risk of containing detectable pesticide levels.

If the differences are this small, they are doing it wrong. I have long suspected that both norms and practices are lax in the US, but I have no objective point of comparison with Europe.

If you're finding organic meat that contains antibiotic-resistant bacteria, then it's not organic. Likewise, if there are detectable levels of pesticides, either they are cheating or they are not sufficiently separated from non-organic crops, and should have their organic status revoked.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 06:14:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If you're finding organic meat that contains antibiotic-resistant bacteria, then it's not organic.

Sadly, I don't think that's true, given the prevalence that multi-resistant strains has reached. Contamination with an already resistant strain from off-site is a real possibility.

Though I do agree that it would merit a compliance investigation.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 09:18:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yeah, and for pesticides it is conceivable that it's coming from a durably polluted water table.

Which brings up an objection that I'm a bit surprised Nomad hasn't voiced : "there's no such thing as organic because we live in a polluted world".

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 09:45:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]
But that would be comparatively straightforward to ascertain, because you know where the farm's water is sourced from, and the pollution levels in that source are monitored.

If either of those is not true, you have much bigger problems than the integrity of your organic certification chain.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 09:49:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Practically speaking, organic farmers are up against the problem that they can rarely find land that has not been previously farmed "conventionally", and that it takes years for pesticide molecules to disappear completely.

This is not to say there are no cases of cheating, of course.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 10:00:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Get the tongue out of your cheek and voice a real ad hominem or just leave me out of it.
by Nomad on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 03:15:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Passive-aggressive semi-drive-by hornets' nest stirring, anyone?

You list a string of talking points against organics, which we know, both from this and from previous discussions, to represent your opinions, but if anyone tries to engage you on any one of these points, you hide behind an alleged scientific consensus.

Here is the hard part: Citation needed.

Here's a citation for you :

Follow the money.

The value of this sort of exercise is, to put it mildly, arguable; it seems to be conducted mostly for your own amusement ("Heh, I knew it would tickle people here.").

Well, if you don't like getting ironic remarks back at you...

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 03:42:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Good grief, did someone put something in the water here? Can we (all) back-off the personal attacks?
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 04:02:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Agrochemical runoff, most likely.

If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 04:05:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]
eurogreen:
You list a string of talking points against organics, which we know, both from this and from previous discussions, to represent your opinions, but if anyone tries to engage you on any one of these points, you hide behind an alleged scientific consensus.

Then show me that there's no such scientific consensus. I've done my homework and I've a bulk of scientific literature on my desk and in my laptop, but it would take me more than a day to write a fully referenced post - in which the latest science findings change little to none. By that time everyone has moved on and busy being angry about another pet-peeve - hence I post what I've observed so far. That sparks fly and heads butt in the following discourse is all fine by me; that's how it is done.

But you don't speak for me.

I draw the line when you write 'an objection that I'm a bit surprised Nomad hasn't voiced'. It is perfectly possible to list a rather ridiculous and philosophical counterpoint without surreptitiously including me.

As a mater of civil debate, leave me out of such practices. Debate what I write, not what you think I would or could write.

Please.

by Nomad on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 05:10:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Apologies for personalising the (lack of?) debate. See my other post for an attempt at defining why I find your "scientific concensus" stance unhelpful.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 05:52:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Apologies are unnecessary but accepted of course. I request civil discourse, bruised feelings are not an issue.
by Nomad on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 11:14:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It has to be pointed out that this is yet again a "review of the literature" study presented as hard science.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:42:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 03:08:56 PM EST
BBC News - Gene therapy restores sense of smell in mice

Gene therapy has been used to give mice born without a sense of smell the ability to sniff their surroundings, an international team of researchers say.

The mice had a genetic disease which affected microscopic hairs in their body - called cilia - which can detect chemicals in the air.

Researchers hope their findings will lead to treatments for diseased cilia, which can cause blindness, deafness and kidney disease in people.

The study is in Nature Medicine.

Microscopic cilia stick out from many cells in the body. A range of genetic disorders called ciliopathies result in damaged cilia which can be fatal or severely debilitating. One symptom can be a lifetime without a sense of smell, called congenital anosmia.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:16:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
BBC News - Dutch teenager convicted of Facebook murder

A 15-year-old Dutch boy has been sentenced to a year in juvenile detention after he confessed to killing a schoolgirl over a row that appears to have begun on Facebook.

Jinhua K was 14 when he fatally stabbed Joyce "Winsie" Hau at her home.

A teenage couple will appear in court next month charged with ordering the killing.

Jinhua was also convicted by the court in the eastern city of Arnhem of attempting to kill his victim's father.

As well as a year in youth detention, he faces up to three years' detention in a psychiatric institution.

The court heard that the row started when school friends Polly W and Joyce "Winsie" Hau fell out over comments Joyce had posted on Polly's Facebook wall.

According to reports in Dutch media, Polly W and her boyfriend gave Jinhua a note with the victim's address and let him know when she would be home.

Jinhua, whose surname is not given under Dutch law, apologised to the court for his actions. He had argued that he had been put under pressure by the girl and was unable to disobey her.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:17:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Magazine considers reversing ban on professional models after two years | Media | guardian.co.uk

Germany's top-selling women's magazine is considering abandoning its use of amateur models barely two years after deciding to banish professional ones.

The fortnightly Brigitte hit the headlines in 2009 when it said it would feature only "real women" in its pages, part of a backlash against the use of ultra-thin professional models in fashion.

However, the magazine is reported to have found working with amateur models a challenge and the move has done nothing to increase sales.

Now, with Stephan Schäfer taking over at the helm as co-editor-in-chief alongside Brigitte Huber, the magazine is reconsidering the policy.

Schäfer has been brought in to give Brigitte, which has been providing German women with a mix of fashion, recipes and lifestyle tips since 1954, a facelift.

"Naturally there is now a new direction at the magazine, which means everything is under review and that includes the no-models policy," confirmed Sabine Grüngreiff, spokeswoman for the magazine's publisher, Gruner + Jahr.

Back in 2009, the former editor-in-chief Andreas Lebert had claimed he was fed up having to retouch photographs of ultra-thin models.

"For years we've had to use Photoshop to fatten the girls up," he said. "Especially their thighs and décolletage."

He said Brigitte's readers had complained that they couldn't identify with the women featured in the magazine. That prompted the magazine to make use of ordinary women, with the first model-free issue appearing in January 2010.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:18:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hehe, "décolletage".
So parts of the body that are mainly composed of fat tend to be smaller when the body has less fat?
Who'd have thunk it.


-----
sapere aude
by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 06:10:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]
This is what it means in French

Precision machining, derived originally from the watchmaking profession. Pretty sexy eh?

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 07:11:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Scarily prescient.


-----
sapere aude
by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 08:03:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Small wonder they have to fatten that up...
by Katrin on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 08:09:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Apparently there are no "normally" sized professional models, so they must use amateurs?

Hmmm.

by asdf on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 02:31:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Apparently Marquita Pring, "plus size", model regularly uses "padding" to look bigger.
I'm betting that padding is only in the "right places".

Generations of selection has created designers and models who expect "thin".

-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 06:25:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Apparently she is a size 12, which is (or used to be) the "normal" size. That's about 160 pounds for a 5' 6" woman, I believe, although dress sizing is notoriously flakey.

So if somebody wants pictures of a girl that is a bit hefty, in the range of size 14 or 16, she adds padding. However, most of the people who hang around the stores that use plus-size models weigh more like 260 pounds, so it's the usual case of the models being very skinny in comparison to the target audience.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/26/marquita-pring-sometimes-_n_909517.html

What I don't get is why there isn't a cadre of professional plus size models in Europe to draw from...maybe there are no fat people in Europe who buy clothes?

by asdf on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 09:24:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Sophie Dahl enjoyed a bit of notoriety as a plus-size model a few years ago.

If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 09:27:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
China's Sexual Revolution Has Reached The Point Of No Return - Business Insider
China's sexual revolution is underway, but it's a complicated, and sometimes contradictory affair. A new book by American journalist Richard Burger -- of the popular Peking Duck blog -- seeks to address those changes by studying China's sexual history over the past 5,000 years.

Behind the Red Door: Sex in China will be released tomorrow, and the introduction is certainly an eye opener:

Every year, thousands of Chinese women pay for an operation to restore their hymens shortly before their wedding so that husbands can see blood on the sheets on their honeymoon night. Brides-to-be who cannot afford the 4,400 yuan operation (about $700) can walk into one of China's 200,000 sex shops or go online to buy a cheap artificial hymen that seeps artificial blood when punctured. Although the percentage of Chinese women who engage in premarital sex has skyrocketed in urban areas from 15 percent in 1990 to more than 50 percent in 2010, conservative attitudes toward sex, even in big cities like Shanghai, remain largely intact. To most Chinese people, virginity matters, and husbands look forward to their wedding night when they can deflower their young virgin brides. For some husbands, the absence of blood on the sheets can be grounds for divorce.

Burger, a former writer for both the Baltimore Sun and the Global Times was one of the first people to start blogging about China in 2002. He told us he was approached by Earnshaw Books to write a book about the changing face of sex in China.

While the book was based on exhaustive research -- Burger says he personally went through thousands of articles and dissertations -- it's not just a piece of academia. The point of the book is to bring China's sexual revolution to a mainstream audience. We've read an advanced proof of the book and have to say its a great read. Burger was kind enough to give us a short interview about the book.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:19:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]
But, but, but ... I'm not finished blaming Muslims for that virginity nonsense! What am I supposed to do now?

-----
sapere aude
by Number 6 on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 08:06:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]
by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 03:09:18 PM EST
Tyler Hamilton's Book Has New Details On Lance Armstrong Doping Allegations - Business Insider

A new book by Lance Armstrong's former cycling teammate Tyler Hamilton has made its way into the hands of the press.

The book is called THE SECRET RACE: Inside The Hidden World Of The Tour De France. Doping, Cover-Ups, And Winning At All Costs.

David Walsh, a journalist at London's Sunday Times who wrote an early article about Armstrong's suspected doping, described the book this weekend.

Hamilton's book describes in vivid detail the sophisticated system that Hamilton says that Armstrong's U.S. Postal team used to stay ahead of the anti-doping authorities, a challenge that Hamilton says was easy, at least in the early years.

Hamilton's book says that Lance Armstrong not only took part in this cheating system, he ran the system.

In the 1998 Tour de France, for example, Hamilton says, the top riders on the team were supplied with blood-doping drug EPO throughout the race by a motorcycle courier who delivered it to the riders in white lunch bags. The courier also worked as a gardener for Armstrong at his house in Nice. Hamilton wasn't considered good enough to get hand-delivered EPO that year, but he wanted it.

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:20:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"Hamilton wasn't considered good enough to get hand-delivered EPO that year, but he wanted it."

How do you retroactively pull out the sour grapes factor in all this? He won, and all of the accusers are people he beat on the way to winning.

by asdf on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 02:44:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hamilton was a team-mate, not someone he beat. Same for the other accusers.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 02:53:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
You don't get to be the team leader by being the most popular.
by asdf on Tue Sep 4th, 2012 at 02:57:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Israeli actress Orly Weinerman urges Tony Blair to save Gadhafi's son, her 'discreet' lover Israel News | Haaretz Daily Newspaper

Israeli actress Orly Weinerman reportedly has urged Tony Blair to help save the life of her "discreet" lover, Saif al-Islam Gadhafi.

The Daily Mail, a British tabloid, quoted Weinerman, 41, as saying that Blair - former British prime minister and now envoy of the Middle East Quartet diplomatic grouping - was an "old friend" of Saif al-Islam, the son of the late ruler of Libya, Muammar Gadhafi.

Saif al-Islam Gadhafi is facing the death penalty in Libya, where he is on trial for his role in the killing of protesters during last year's uprising against his father.

Weinerman "dated" Saif al-Islam for six year, after meeting him in London in 2005, the tabloid reported.

The paper quotes her as saying that "Saif worked closely with Mr. Blair before he was captured. The two are old friends."

by Nomad on Mon Sep 3rd, 2012 at 05:21:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]


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