Wednesday Open Thread

by afew Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 11:39:31 AM EST

Another day, another dollar?

Wednesday Open Thread | 73 comments (73 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 11:40:08 AM EST

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (4.00 / 4)

Chinese knockoff artists patent iPhone 5 design before Apple: report | The Raw Story

Apple may have just lost a key battle in China before they even began to fight it.
A report by Chinese electronics site GizChina claims that a company called GooPhone boasted that it has obtained a Chinese patent on the design of Apple's iPhone 5, taken from leaked photos of the device that were published online.
Their phone, the GooPhone i5, will reportedly ship with Android 4.0 and some pretty capable hardware, including a quad-core 1.4Ghz processor, an 8 mega-pixel camera, a high-def screen and even an Android desktop theme designed to look just like an iPhone's characteristic layout.
GooPhone is one of many Chinese electronics knockoff-makers that have gotten especially good at their mimicry in recent years, but if it's true that they've obtained a patent on the iPhone 5′s design before Apple even announced it, that could give them leverage in the courts -- possibly even enough to challenge Apple's right to sell its device in the country.

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 11:41:26 AM EST

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

hooray, the biter bit

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 01:00:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 1)

The rich are becoming even more blatant:

World's richest woman suggests $2 a day wages for Australian miners | The Raw Story

The world's most wealthy woman is warning that firms are in danger of having to abandon iron-ore mining in Australia if wages are not cut, pointing out that African miners are "willing to work for less than $2 per day."
In a video recently posted on the Sydney Mining Club website, 58-year-old Gina Rinehart -- who has amassed a $18 billion fortune through iron-ore prospecting -- said that Australia could be more competitive by emulating Africa.
"We must be realistic, not just promote class warfare," the billionaire explained. "Indeed, if we competed at the Olympic games as sluggishly as we compete economically, there would be an outcry."

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 11:43:17 AM EST

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

"if we competed at the Olympic games as sluggishly as we compete economically, there would be an outcry."

I agree with her on that point, although exactly how to go about such competition is debatable.

by asdf on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:03:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (4.00 / 2)

"We must be realistic, not just promote class warfare,"

Says the one promoting class warfre against the poor. You have been warned before: Rinehart is the next Murdoch.

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:43:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

Rineheart is just another entitled rich bigot who should be in the US republican party.

the saddest thing is how many australian politicians line up to enable her bullshit.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 01:02:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

I salute this lady for her honesty ... she states openly what most rich think but are too cowardly to speak. Humans are a resource, nothing more ... like cattle. The next step in this "social evolution" is to decide now best to harvest this resource ... they really are making a mess of the earth. Keep it "peaceful" ... don't want the cattle figuring out what's going on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wp4O7v5320

by THE Twank (yatta blah blah @ blah.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 07:00:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

How many sides does a triangle have? (none / 1)

Have you seen this before?

...and these people can vote for the man who can put his finger on the nuclear button...

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 11:49:31 AM EST

Re: How many sides does a triangle have? (none / 0)

OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Shaking head!!!

by Fran (fran at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 11:57:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

There are no sides... (none / 0)

We are all in this together.

_{It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue
- Queen Elizabeth II}

by eurogreen on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:31:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: How many sides does a triangle have? (none / 1)

Right, so the whole point of democracy is to avoid revolutions, not to have good government. I think that was the point that Plato was making a couple of thousand years ago...

by asdf on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:06:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: How many sides does a triangle have? (none / 1)

Gah, you could replicate that result anywhere. Igonrance is not confined to the US of A

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:59:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: How many sides does a triangle have? (none / 0)

It's my guess that none of these folks visit ET.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wp4O7v5320

by THE Twank (yatta blah blah @ blah.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 05:36:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

Not at the bloody rate my week is going.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 11:55:28 AM EST

Swag (4.00 / 3)

You know you're old when youth language leaves you behind. Some English buzzwords I became aware of recently:

Swag: seems to have replaced "cool" the same way "celeb" replaced "star". Which represented a shift from someone acting big because s/he achieved something with talent to people having the gall to act big even if based on nothing much (like Paris Hilton wasting inherited money with style or the n-th talent show dropout or Justin Bieber). "Sawg" also seems to be a much-hated word for other segments of English-speaking youth(?), as indicated by the innumerable derogatory definitions of the word at Urban Dictionary, for example:

A stupid saying that's overused. People 90 per cent are dumb teenagers, 10 per cent are little ass kids trying to be cool use it for EVERYTHING and also as their facebook name thinking that shit's cute: 'I just opened a cabinet, SWAG.' 'I just fell down, lol, SWAG.' 'SWAGNIFICENT' '(your name) idontgiveafuq gotsswagg' 'lives in swagtown' 'works at swagville' 'That show was so SWAG.' 'I just finished brushing my teeth, SWAG.' 'Hey guys, just woke up, SWAG.' 'Lol, I got kicked out of class, SWAG.' 'I cursed the teacher out, SWAG.' 'Tumbling on tumblr in class, SWAG.' '(your name) the swag god' 'texting in class, SWAG' ... 'SWAG.' You don't have no motherfucking swag.
You: 'I got swag.'
Me: 'That's because you're a fucking retard trying to be like the rest of the try hards thinking their dumb ass have swag.'

Epic: alternative for "great", nothing more, nothing less, it seems to me.
Hipster: this one is a mystery to me. It seems to be used for those who don't want to go along with the rest in following a trend, but the more literal meaning seems to be a snob who seeks the latest trends.
Hater: troll spoiling the party in a cult.
Random: used by a person impressed by something out of the ordinary. I hate it because it seems to be making up for the insufficiency of that person's vocabulary for the task of describing the experience.

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:07:28 PM EST

Re: Swag (4.00 / 3)

I'm old, but these four terms seem to be pretty established in the U.S. at least.

Epic does mean "great." It's from the 1980s movies, along with "dude" and "awesome." "Awesome" is quite commonly encountered in daily conversation.

A hipster seems to be a cross between a metrosexual and a fifties retro enthusiast. Glasses that look like the old plastic ones, unusual beards and hairstyles, progressive politics, clothing taken from the fifties, sort of. I suspect that many people on ET either are hipsters, or would be if they weren't doddering around with canes and hearing aids.

A hater is anybody who doesn't fit in with the mainstream, whatever it might be. I suppose that it depends on what crowd you're in, because if you're a Tea Party enthusiast then Obama is a hater. A hater is somebody who is vehement in his views, in contrast to someone who is simply random in his views.

I think random can be used to describe anything that doesn't conform to expectations. "His politics are pretty random."

by asdf on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:53:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

New language usage may be popularized by movies, but are perhaps never introduced by them, except when a phrase is used in a completely other context.

Movies get words from the street. Dude came from 1890's Greenwich Village by way of SoCal surfers, as one example.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 01:31:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

Am I rite in reading 1980s?

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 02:52:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 1)

Nope. First used in 1870 (!)

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 02:58:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

if you're a Tea Party enthusiast then Obama is a hater

That would mean that the word hater implies projection on the part of the speaker.

If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 02:13:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 1)

Well - some of these are at least fifteen years old.

Bill Gates was using 'random' back when he used to be famous for something or other.

Also, hipsters.

'Swag' is newish. So is 'yolo'.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 01:01:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

Hipster was common in the fifties and sixties:

Online Etymology Dictionary

hipster (n.)
1941, "one who is hip;" from hip (adj.) + -ster. Meaning "low-rise" in reference to pants or skirt is from 1962

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 02:55:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 1)

Hints on how to be a hipster, demonstrating my claim about ETers:

1. Hone your humor. A hipster is known for their strong sense of irony and sarcasm. When asked a question, refuse to answer directly; instead, obfuscate, ask a question in return, or just be plain sarcastic. Be sure to layer on the smirk to indicate your lack of seriousness, because it's possible for the other person to mistake your sarcasm for sincerity.
For example: When in a theater watching a movie, and the person next to you turns to say, "Oh, my God, that was so cool! Did you see that?", in a dry tone, reply something along the lines of, "No, I paid $12.50 to stare at the ceiling."
Watch British comedies for examples of good uses of sarcasm you can borrow.
Have a sense of humorous perspective and don't take yourself too seriously. Hipsters are often parodied, so knowing how to laugh at derision will help a lot.
2. Start growing your own food and turn vegetarian. Start growing your own food and turn vegetarian. Use compost if possible. If you have absolutely no space to do this (not even a balcony or a window sill), go to a natural foods market instead. Eating meat isn't exactly popular with the hipster culture, and many hipsters tend to be vegetarian or vegan. If you do eat meat, you must assert that choice as a cynical transcendence of vegetarians' futile attempts to save the world-- your sense of irony has already deemed that movement obsolete.

http://www.wikihow.com/Be-a-Hipster

by asdf on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 04:11:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

The way I see it used, "hipster" developed further to mean any "hater" using sarcasm or another mild form of derision.

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 03:44:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

The words themselves aren't new, but their popularity, the curcle who use it, and the connotations for those who use it may change. "Hipster" in particular goes back long and was also the origin of "hippie", I am told.

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 03:18:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

I think the meaning of hipster now is different from what it was in the 1950s.

In one sense it means modern, or with the latest trend, so from that viewpoint it's similar, but a hipster from 1955 listening to cool jazz and wearing baggy blue jeans and slicked back hair is not immediately transferable to a 2012 hipster listening to indy music, wearing tight blue jeans, and purple hair.

Hmmm. Not so sure now...

by asdf on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 04:06:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

To be hip is to be 'in the know', i.e. to have and display knowledge of what's in among the very in-crowd. 60 years ago it was mainly about music and soft drugs, now more about design and media.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 04:25:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (4.00 / 2)

The hipster is never a punter, or at least will never want to be seen as one.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 04:26:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

Punter = blaireau I guess, in the local vernacular. Very opposite of hipster, indeed.

_{It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue
- Queen Elizabeth II}

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 03:33:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

It's also a failed attempt at authenticity - hipsters are stuck with role-playing consumerism. This is why they get into the recursive state of "no hipster will admit to being a hipster because hipsters known hipster are inauthentic."

you are the media you consume.

by MillMan (millguy at gmail) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 05:45:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

rebellion (none / 1)

Didn't the original connotation of hipster finally surfacing in the 50's denote a choice of rebellion against the grey flannel suit world? If so, the early hipster was in some way authentic, at least in disavowing the consumer world.

The rebellion only increased as hipsters evolved into hippies. At least for many. how far we've fallen.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 05:52:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: rebellion (none / 0)

Yes I think that was the original connotation. My claim is a (more or less) common modern critique.

you are the media you consume.

by MillMan (millguy at gmail) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 05:57:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Damn hippies (none / 0)

The hipster of the late Fifties was cool, urban and materialistic, and never associated with academia. The Beats otoh had close associations with academia and were largely against materialism - it was all mind and art.

The hippies combined both, though I'd guess there was far more hipsterism in the upper echelons of hippiedom (those with media and event organization connections)

But of course these 'titles' cover a vast multitude of sins, and tend to have local connotations and definitions. You lived in the maelström of it, I was an observer from abroad.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 04:19:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

I think the meaning of hipster now is different from what it was in the 1950s.

That's what I mean.

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 03:40:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Swag (none / 0)

Epic. I've always taken epic to mean greater-than-great, often said sarcastically.

Hipster. I don't think hipster is metrosexual, as asdf says. (Quite the contrary. Aren't hipsters supposed to be unkempt and non-flashy?) It seems to be more artsy twentysomethings in '70s punk outfits. Irony also enters into it: They're mostly middle- to upper-middle-class kids and think it's funny to do "working-class" things -- the most "obvious" of which is to drink Pabst Blue Ribbon (apparently the Official Beer of the Working Man).

If Adam Duritz sang for Nine Inch Nails while wearing a UAW t-shirt, it would be the ultimate hipster band.

Hater. A hater means about 50 different things. It's usually used to refer to people who I'm fairly sure aren't haters.

Swag. It's swagger, but with an undertone of sort of glorifying criminality. Think "thug," but meant in a good way. The University of Miami football teams of the '80s are responsible for the emergence of swag.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.

by Drew J Jones (pedobear@pennstatefootball.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 01:43:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

Greek Reporter: German Economist Says Greece Must Quit Euro

Greece needs to leave the Eurozone and bring back the drachma if it wants to get back on its feet and return to growth, Manfred Neumann, Professor of Economics at the Institute for Economic Policy at the University of Bonn told CNBC on Sept. 5. The country's dominant tourism industry and exports simply cannot recover by lowering prices and wages, he said.
"It has to be done by devaluation and therefore they need their own currency," said Neumann, who supervised German Bundesbank chief Jens Weidmann's 1997 doctoral thesis. A decision on whether Greece will receive further aid from international creditors to cover its funding needs will be taken in October and lenders said the country must continue to make reforms and cut another $14.6 billion in spending.
Other countries may also need to leave, Neumann said, adding that under a very negative scenario in which he does not believe, the entire southern region could have to leave the financial bloc that includes 17 countries. "Now with respect to the other countries, I would say ... if we are very negative ... I'm an optimist, but if you (are) a pessimist, you would say possibly - over the next 10 to 15 years, the whole south has to leave," he said.

I'm glad that's cleared up. Now, if they have to leave over the next 15 years, why not leave now?

If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:13:23 PM EST

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

Migeru:

Neumann, who supervised German Bundesbank chief Jens Weidmann's 1997 doctoral thesis.

Selection/confirmation bias, anyone?

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:51:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (4.00 / 4)

NOSARA, Costa Rica - A powerful, magnitude-7.6 earthquake shook Costa Rica and a wide swath of Central America on Wednesday. There were no immediate accounts of injuries, but communications were down near the epicenter.

"Beware of the man who does not talk, and the dog that does not bark." Cheyenne

by maracatu on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:24:51 PM EST

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

that's a hefty one.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 03:11:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

La Vuelta (4.00 / 2)

Anyone who followed the cycle race around Spain? Since arrivals are around the time I return home from work, I semi-followed it, and especially after today, I must say... my impression is that doping is alive and well, looking at Joaquim Rodríguez's improbable race.

Up until today, Rodríguez beat Contador on every mountain stage by effortlessly countering his attacks. It was unreal, and in bad style: it seemed he had enough power to work up a distance of minutes had he tried an Armstrong-style sustained attack, but he just stuck around like a mosquito and made his breakaways (if at all) on the last kilometre only. It was as if he didn't want to show just how much more strong he is. Then today, after rumours of a planned police sweep on his team, he suddenly fell behind and arrived 2 minutes 28 seconds behind Contador! WTF?

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 12:40:50 PM EST

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

What I want to know is, why are sports considered special cases regarding drugs?

Every business environment is awash in coffee, a powerful psychoactive drug.
Recreational drugs, legal, semi-legal, and illegal, are broadly used in the general population.
Soldiers go into battle on drugs.
Defendants go to court on drugs, to avoid unscripted outbursts.
Over-the-counter drugs to "solve" medical issues drive an entire industry.
Prescription drugs, obviously.
Etc.

And then there is this tiny sub-segment of the population that is supposed to live completely drug free. I suppose it has something to do with the alleged "purity" of sports, which is obviously baloney...

by asdf on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 01:02:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 1)

Coffee is a stimulant. A powerful psychoactive drug is ibogaine, or Yagé, or Peyote, or 2C-B.

In sports, the goal is to level the playing field with respect to chemical, or biological performance enhancement.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 01:18:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

I think the worry is more about an "arms race" in drugs if they were allowed, which would bring money into the loop. But money is already in the loop.

Personally, if people want to shave off 25 years of their life for a chance at sport glory, why not? Athletes are already sacrificing years of their lifes training for these sports, so it's not like it's a different kind of investment.

Wind power

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 02:04:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (4.00 / 2)

Because the best-organized with the most cash (they go together) get the really prize-winning protocols with good cover against tests. That's what the Lance Armstrong business is about. The result is the loss of unpredictability and excitement in sporting competition.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 03:01:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 1)

The solution to that is simply to have an open class.

That would also have the effect of making the events even more unpredictable, what with random competitors dying on the course.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 03:20:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

And just think of the marketing opportunities allowing drugs would bring. Take <whatever it was> and be like Armstrong.....

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 03:43:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

Once again here, the assumption (even in jest) that the protocols used in top sporting performance are somehow open to all on a free market.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 02:46:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (4.00 / 2)

Not to mention the assumption that advertisers are always telling the truth and the full truth....

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 02:52:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (4.00 / 3)

Personally, if people want to shave off 25 years of their life for a chance at sport glory, why not? Athletes are already sacrificing years of their lifes training for these sports, so it's not like it's a different kind of investment.

I'm not totally sanguine about the occupational health and safety implications of medicating healthy people so they can do their job better.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 04:32:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

Doesn't your workplace give out free coffee?

by asdf on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 08:01:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (4.00 / 2)

What has this to do with hugely expensive protocols administered by hugely-paid doctors, in which one team (US Postal with Armstrong to take the Tour de France example) has the edge on the others (Hamilton says Armstrong was two years ahead of the field in doping techniques) and to which only competitors considered strategically key get access?

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 02:44:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

"Hamilton says Armstrong was two years ahead of the field in doping techniques"

More sour grapes.

by asdf on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 12:06:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

Strange then that Armstrong has given up on defending himself.

And -- once again -- these are not competitors who were beaten by Armstrong who are making the allegations, they're his team-mates who shared in the team victory and the reflected Armstrong glory. So no sour grapes.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 01:36:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

The boost from coffee is small enough that it can by and large disappear within the ordinary range of human performance.

Also, getting adequate sleep is an acceptable, non-harmful substitute for caffeine. So it's not like there's a huge pressure to self-medicate on coffee.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 04:42:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

No, it doesn't. But on the other hand, an espresso will always cost less than 1 Euro (no Starbucks here....)

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 04:49:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

No Starbucks? That settles it then, I'm not visiting.

by asdf on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 12:04:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

We're not that far from the Austrian border, and you can get Starbucks In Austria, as well as McDonalds and Burger King (did I mention we don't have them in town either?)

by gk (g k quattro due due sette "at" gmail.com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 03:47:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 1)

Fairly sure there are places in Italy where you can buy a crappy cup of coffee at top dollar.

Ever since I learnt about confirmation bias I've started seeing it everywhere

by ATinNM on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 05:14:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (4.00 / 3)

I'm not totally sanguine about the occupational health and safety implications of medicating healthy people so they can do their job better.

Well, that's the approach that broke the back of doping in professional cycling in France : occupational health. The pros are subject to regular checkups, and can be stood down from their jobs, on a no-fault basis, if their performances can't be licitly explained.

This system has been in place since the big doping scandals on the Tour de France ten years ago. Coincidentally, no French rider has been competitive in the TDF over this period.

_{It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue
- Queen Elizabeth II}

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 03:46:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

Up until yesterday's result : Just change the names, and it's a description of any TDF of the past ten years. Until this year.

I note that, this year, a number of the favourites or challengers exhibited Rodriguez-like collapse of performance, or at very least turned out to be uncompetitive over the three weeks. i.e. I believe that the TDF was pretty clean this year (otherwise, a clean athlete like Boardman could not have won it).

What will it take to clean up the Vuelta? The UCI and ASO (owners of the TDF) are not spontaneously given to cleanness; they were dragged kicking and screaming to it by the French authorities, and it took a decade. So the Spanish authorities would have to be determined to clean it up.

_{It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue
- Queen Elizabeth II}

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 03:56:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

Boardman = Wiggins

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 08:51:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: La Vuelta (none / 0)

Brain fart

_{It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue
- Queen Elizabeth II}

by eurogreen on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 12:42:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 1)

A local pub was offering Christmas party bookings.

Two weeks ago.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 01:38:07 PM EST

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

Yea, you see that in London a lot around this time

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 02:14:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 1)

We have discussed before that the Beltway DC commentators have a inbuilt bias towards the republican point of view. In any discussion, the GOP are the adults who speak the conventional wisdom. Conversely, the democrats are the fanatics, the outliers who have mad plans and can neither be trusted nor relied upon.

We've kinda got used to it, but I'm getting fed up with seeing their distortions reflected in the UK press. I simply do not recognise the descriptions of events I read in the Independent or Guardian, let alone see on the BBC from what I've seen in the blogs. I read Nate Silver's careful and detailed analysis of trends and yet can see no sign of it in the msm.

How do they reconcile the results that happen from the mockery of predictions they maintain day to day ?

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 04:16:20 PM EST

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 1)

David Koch breaks from GOP on gay marriage, taxes, defense cuts - Kenneth P. Vogel - POLITICO.com

TAMPA, Fla. - Billionaire industrialist David Koch, who is helping steer millions of dollars to elect Mitt Romney and congressional Republicans, on Thursday told POLITICO he disagrees with the GOP's stance on gay marriage and believes the U.S. needs to consider raising taxes to balance the budget.
Koch, who is serving as a delegate to the Republican National Convention from New York, spoke to POLITICO after delivering brief remarks at a reception held in his honor by Americans for Prosperity, the political advocacy group he chairs and has helped fund.

by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 04:49:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

Eh ? That doesn't make any sense, whats he up to ?

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 05:24:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

Bet you dollars to donuts that the taxes he wants to raise are not on the top bracket or on ~~capital gains~~financial asset price inflation.

- Jake

If you only spend 20 minutes of the rest of your life on economics, go spend them here.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 05:30:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

Ah, yea, that at least makes sense

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 02:48:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 1)

Same thing about the Spanish press. The Convention coverage in El Pais has been appalling. And you know what's worse? Javier friggin' Solana just congratulated the correspondent on twitter.

If you are not convinced, try it on someone who has not been entirely debauched by economics. — Piero Sraffa

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 06:31:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (4.00 / 3)

The thing you have to remember: Reporters are, generally speaking, idiots. They don't know anything about anything. Especially in the last 30 years, we've undergone a kind of ESPNification of political coverage. (ESPN is the worst thing ever, except their idiocy doesn't result in dead people.)

So expecting them to comprehend complex demographic trends -- and whether Obama wins or loses, the trends are still bad for the GOPers -- is asking far too much. They still think Reagan is King. Getting them to understand why the GOPers are fucked in places like NC and VA in the long run is impossible.

The Brits in the press just follow what their American counterparts pimp. Which is strange, as American mainstream media is dying, because nobody below he age of 80 wants to listen to these idiots (and those above 80 only do it out of force of habit).

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.

by Drew J Jones (pedobear@pennstatefootball.com) on Wed Sep 5th, 2012 at 07:47:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Wednesday Open Thread (none / 0)

Helen:

In any discussion, the GOP are the adults who speak the conventional wisdom. Conversely, the democrats are the fanatics, the outliers who have mad plans and can neither be trusted nor relied upon.

interesting insight.

dems bring out the youth, the idealists, the clowns, the storytellers, the puppeteers, a madcap crew to the archie bunker types.

mind you the teabaggers are as visually, um, random but they're old, therefore accorded more trust.

young people aren't perceived to be trustworthy basically...

i don't trust the ones who go far right, but it's not a ageism issue.

It's a fine line between homage, parody, and consumer opportunism. Jess Walter

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Thu Sep 6th, 2012 at 09:57:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Wednesday Open Thread | 73 comments (73 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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