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A new French political party | 26 comments (26 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)
Re: A new French political party (4.00 / 2)
I think the party's logo (a snail) is quite fun, but nothing tops the logo of Otra Democracia es Posible (Another Democracy is Possible). I was so sick of the Spanish political parties last year that I actually gave them one of my 3 senate votes.

A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman
by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Nov 14th, 2005 at 05:41:44 PM EST
Re: A new French political party (none / 0)
Excellent logo!!!
by Alex in Toulouse on Mon Nov 14th, 2005 at 05:44:33 PM EST
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Re: A new French political party (none / 0)
N'est-ce pas?

Now all wee need to do is make it a Pan-European party. Another Europe is Possible!

A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman

by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Nov 14th, 2005 at 05:47:42 PM EST
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Re: A new French political party (none / 1)
They do raise an important point: that no country other than Switzerland, has even gotten "remotely close" to implementing participative democracy. Basically you vote for someone, and then they do as they please. Not good. We should have a say on all matters.

Granted that some matters will bore us to death ("calling in your votes, today we are voting on the normalization of green pea sizes in Europe"), but at least if we could submit laws, change law proposals, and refuse laws, through a participative system like in Switzerland, life would be so much better.

On the other hand, this accepts that people are mature enough to make all decisions, when clearly they aren't (example: when the death penalty was abolished in France, a strong majority of the population was still in favour of it ... it took nearly 15 years for this trend to reverse, even though the law had already been passed => this is thus a good example of elected officials actually being more mature than the people).

by Alex in Toulouse on Mon Nov 14th, 2005 at 05:49:40 PM EST
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Re: A new French political party (none / 1)
Another sad example of politicians ahead of their people happened during the Second Spanish Republic. The Socialist government gave women the vote even though most women (under stronger clerical influence) thought it was a bad idea. In 1934 the women proceeded to vote the socialists out (as instructed by priests during mass). Then after 1939 they were reduced to second-class citizenship again. While they retained the vote, as late as the 1970's my mother needed my father to open a bank account for her so the Government could pay her teacher salary. Just like a child's account, really.

A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman
by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Nov 14th, 2005 at 05:54:44 PM EST
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Speaking as a Swiss citizen, (none / 0)
participative democracy is a double-edged sword. Much nonsense has gotten thrown out by popular votes; other issues were voted on several times until accepted. Generally, the whole process is moving at glacial speed (not necessarily a bad thing though, but in some cases it is). The focus on consensus by most politicians (as any issue could be voted on) makes it difficult for an elected majority to do silly stuff.

In two weeks, we vote on two issues. A law which allows shops near big train station and airports to open on sundays (until now a matter of canton legislation, I think). Further, we vote on a 5 year moratorium for the use of GM plants and animals in agriculture.

by srutis on Mon Nov 14th, 2005 at 06:11:40 PM EST
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Re: Speaking as a Swiss citizen, (none / 0)
Indeed it is.

And Switzerland's land/population size does allow for easier management, I suppose. Smaller means => less issues to handle. I don't mean this in a diminutive way, i.e. socially, economically, politically Switzerland must face exactly the same problems we all face, but there are fewer airports for example :)

by Alex in Toulouse on Mon Nov 14th, 2005 at 06:24:47 PM EST
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Re: Speaking as a Swiss citizen, (none / 0)
Are you kidding, I mean about the less issues to handle, because of the smallness of Switzerland. Do you know all the stuff we are voting on! at times it seems never-ending hand difficult to stay "really" informed on all of them.
by Fran on Tue Nov 15th, 2005 at 01:55:37 AM EST
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Re: Speaking as a Swiss citizen, (none / 0)
I believe you!!! (even only 2 issues a week means a lot of homework to read about them, and be objective)

But then the question is, if it's hard to keep in touch with all the issues in Switzerland, it's also got to be hard in France ... so my question is, how do elected officials in France manage to stay informed on every issue that they vote on, if they're busy being politicians all day long, giving interviews, flattering their own egos, shaking hands, and skipping parliament every other day? These guys probably have no idea what they're voting on!!!

by Alex in Toulouse on Tue Nov 15th, 2005 at 03:40:28 AM EST
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A new French political party | 26 comments (26 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)
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