The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource nationalism | 107 comments (107 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource (none / 0)

Due to reactor physics it "only" contains 60 times as much energy as the original U-235.

What do you mean "contains 60 times as much energy" than U-235? In what sense?

The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom - William Blake

by talos (mihalis at gmail dot com) on Tue Jun 27th, 2006 at 07:36:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource (none / 0)

I think he means 140 times more weight only contains 60 times more energy.

A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman

by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Jun 27th, 2006 at 07:37:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource (none / 0)

Yep, that's what I meant.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.

by Starvid on Tue Jun 27th, 2006 at 07:45:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource (none / 0)

Ok, what energy are talking about? The energy that can be produced per gram of U-23X in a fission reactor? Do you know of a currently operating commercial fission reactor that uses U-238? Or are we talking about breeder reactors? I'm confused?

The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom - William Blake

by talos (mihalis at gmail dot com) on Tue Jun 27th, 2006 at 07:47:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource (none / 0)

There are CANDU reactors which burn U238 and are used to produce energy.

A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman

by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Jun 27th, 2006 at 07:52:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource (none / 0)

Unless the Wikipedia article is missing something, no they don't...

The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom - William Blake

by talos (mihalis at gmail dot com) on Tue Jun 27th, 2006 at 08:02:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource (none / 1)

Running on natural uranium, they start-up with the U235 in it, but during the cycle between fwo refuelling, they do turn a lot of the u238 in p239 (that's called having a "high breeding ratio", all reactors have a breeding ratio, they're not call breeders unless it's >1, self-sustained cycles if ~1, and vanilla if <1. In a PWR, something like 25% of the energy at the end of the life of the rods is from p239=from the original u238. The future EPR will have a breeding ratio of 0.7, so it will be even higher than that.)

Candu reactors have high breeding ratios with uranium and thorium, unfortunately the uranium side makes them proliferation friendly (I have a canadian science paper on this I should deconstruct one day).

Pierre

by Pierre on Wed Jun 28th, 2006 at 04:18:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource (none / 0)

They use natural (unenriched) uranium, not U-238 if I remember correctly.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.

by Starvid on Tue Jun 27th, 2006 at 08:07:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource (none / 0)

True.

A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman

by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Jun 27th, 2006 at 08:09:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource (none / 0)

I was thinking of breeders.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.

by Starvid on Tue Jun 27th, 2006 at 08:05:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource (none / 1)

OK, so we're not talking about currently operating commercial fission reactors, but possible future reactors. Still there are quite a few problems with breeders (not least of which is non-proliferation).

For an (oldish) breeder assessment see "Nuclear Power and Energy Security: A Revised Strategy for Japan (1998)" specifically chpt. 4. AFAIK the problems it highlights are still problems today (but I could be wrong).

For a more general skeptical view of nuclear (fission) power in general see "WHY NUCLEAR POWER CANNOT BE A MAJOR ENERGY SOURCE"...

The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom - William Blake

by talos (mihalis at gmail dot com) on Tue Jun 27th, 2006 at 08:51:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Thankyouthankyouthankyou (none / 0)

For the second link.

The Fates are kind.

by Gaianne on Wed Jun 28th, 2006 at 03:04:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

The real enemy is not peak oil, it's resource nationalism | 107 comments (107 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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