Welcome to European Tribune. It's gone a bit quiet around here these days, but it's still going.
Display:
My thoughts.

While there is a vocal spat going on between the US and Russia, I think the actual chances of military conflict between the two are about zilch at the moment, while it seems the US Administration is still keen on bombing Iran.  

So far as Doomsday scenarios go, I don't think Russia is promoting this rhetoric but reacting to US policy by making obvious comparisons.  It's the US who started this.  I think if Russia were installing missile shields on the Mexican border, we'd be rightly pissed off.  And that Russia has every right to respond to military build up along its borders with parallel measures of their own.  One would think that their pointing out this obvious fact would serve to deter US plans, but instead, people are interpreting it as some kind of provocation.  It is a rational response, not a provocation.  

I mean, can anyone explain what is the purpose of US missile defenses in Poland and the Czech Republic?  People afraid those Soviet tanks are going to roll back into town?  Well, it is not 1968.  It is 2007, and Russia has shown no imperialist tendencies for years.  They are too busy trying to keep their own federation from breaking apart.  More importantly, they are no longer beholden to a political ideology which mandates political evangelism (Communism).  No.  It's the US who is running around the planet invading countries with their arsenal of democracy, trying to convert the world at gunpoint with no thought of the consequences of our actions.  So Russia pipes up and points out the consequences, and the onus is on them?  BS.  

Well-informed readers may wonder why the Russians are painting a picture of the US and Russia on the brink of nuclear war, aligning themselves with Iran, abrogating treaties, and in general making such a fuss about ABM installations, even though virtually every ABM test ends in total failure.

Well informed readers hopefully see this situation in less simplistic and cliched terms.

I don't know what the solution here is, but since we know Bush is a madman and Putin is no push-over, one would hope that the er, uhm, CZECH and POLISH folks would realize how stupid this idea is, that the EU might intervene (I think that might go a long way towards mitigating Russian "sabre-rattling" over there) and that people could get their acts together and agree that relying on the US to protect you from unlikely threats is insane.  I mean, don't bitch about out defense budget and then turn to us for ... defense!  Insane!

Meanwhile, I hope people like us can remain calm and not buy into this neo-Cold War hysteria.  Let's not forget why it was called a "Cold" war.   And let's try to make sensible and informed arguments without relying on rhetoric like "hair-trigger," "nightmare," and "doomsday."  This isn't a Hollywood movie.  This is foreign policy.

"Pretending that you already know the answer when you don't is not actually very helpful." ~Migeru.

by poemless on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 11:53:51 AM EST
Well informed readers hopefully see this situation in less simplistic and cliched terms.

When you talk about my diary as "simplistic and cliched," do you have something in mind like this:

Well, it is not 1968.

or this:
It's the US who started this.

or this:
one would hope that the er, uhm, CZECH and POLISH folks would realize how stupid this idea is

or this:
This isn't a Hollywood movie.  This is foreign policy.

Thanks for providing a little hall of fame of simplistic remarks and cliche's, and for being dense enough to call attention to it by insulting me!

(I only posted on European Tribune out of admiration for Jerome, and the rest of it is just a sad joke.)

by Jacob Freeze on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 12:08:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]
You know, a lot of people have taken the time to carefully read your post and to thoughtfully comment.  Why do you treat them so poorly?  Can't we freely exchange ideas without personal attacks?

My comments we not about you, but the situation you write about.  

"Pretending that you already know the answer when you don't is not actually very helpful." ~Migeru.

by poemless on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 12:11:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Check it out! You blockquote a section of my diary, and my description of a very salient element of the current situation between Washington and Moscow, and directly underneath you write your "clever" little comment. And now you claim it wasn't really about me, so you can whine about having the same terms returned to sender.

Pathetic!

Well-informed readers may wonder why the Russians are painting a picture of the US and Russia on the brink of nuclear war, aligning themselves with Iran, abrogating treaties, and in general making such a fuss about ABM installations, even though virtually every ABM test ends in total failure.

"Well informed readers hopefully see this situation in less simplistic and cliched terms."



(I only posted on European Tribune out of admiration for Jerome, and the rest of it is just a sad joke.)
by Jacob Freeze on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 12:32:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I remain hopeful that at some point you can return to my comments and the constructive comments of others with a bit less defensiveness and a bit more patience and gain something practical from this experience.   Perhaps there should be a Warning! sign when you sign up to this site that lets you know that this is a forum for genuine debate and ad hominem attacks are not likely to be tolerated because they get in the way of informative discussion.

Again, it is not you that I've insulted.  It is the unhelpful way this subject is framed everywhere in the media.  I'd say your post was much more fair than a lot of coverage.  But it is very easy -for anyone- to slip into the old ways of talking about US-Russia relations, relying more on emotive rhetoric than reason and facts.  It is a simplistic approach, and I do hope well informed readers can see that.  Because, frankly, it is not you Jacob, I'm concerned about.  It's what you are writing about.  

"Pretending that you already know the answer when you don't is not actually very helpful." ~Migeru.

by poemless on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 01:08:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
You don't deserve a single comment on your threads. Your constant insults call for troll ratings.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 12:23:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Jacob, did you delete your Boom! Headshot! diary and everyone's comments to it?

We have met the enemy, and he is us — Pogo
by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 12:28:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I deleted that thing when I noticed it had 80 comments and no recommends.

At that time I though maybe a little more credit should be given for stimulating discussion and a little less for rehashing les idées reçues.

This diary is probably destined for the same oblivion, unless something radically improves.

(I only posted on European Tribune out of admiration for Jerome, and the rest of it is just a sad joke.)

by Jacob Freeze on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 01:11:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It so happens that your previous diary was devoid of content but did spawn an interesting comment thread. This one has interesting content but you're doing a good job of derailing any discussion.

If you delete another one of your diaries we might be forced to take away your ability to edit your own stories once posted.

We have met the enemy, and he is us — Pogo

by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 01:17:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Once a diary is published and spawns a discussion I would consider that it is "owned" by the community who have contributed to that discussion, and not just by the diary author.  I would be quite annoyed if I had spent a lot of time writing a considered comment only to find it had been deleted.  

Index of Frank's Diaries
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 02:15:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
What's more the diary and its comments really disappear. We can't conjure them back up from the bowels of the software.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 02:29:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Deleting diaries in a fit of pique is pretty bad form since it involves deleting other people's contributions. Don't bother posting diaries if that's going to be your attitude.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 01:19:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If it is any consolation to you Jacob, what I consider to have been my best diary got the least comments and recommends as you put it.  Some topics are simply a minority taste and don't attract much of a readership or debate - often because others don't feel qualified to comment.  

I suspect there are very few military strategists here and so few would feel qualified to engage with you on your central thesis.  We are here to learn, perhaps to add a minor or supplementary comment, not as experts to peer review a scholarly work.

Writing a comment and checking out the reaction to it is the best way of testing out a half formed thought or theory.  If we were experts, we probably wouldn't be here in the first place!

Index of Frank's Diaries

by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Thu Dec 20th, 2007 at 01:26:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Display:

Occasional Series