strangely... | 41 comments (41 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: On distance (none / 0)

One never knows what all these reports are actually counting unless one reads the small print. I think in this case the report was from a NZ university

A survey by scientists at the University of Lincoln in New Zealand, concluded that lamb imported from New Zealand is four times as energy efficient as lamb reared in the UK, even when carbon emissions from the transport process are taken into account.
The study calculated 688kg of CO2 is emitted per tonne of carcass, through the lamb production process in New Zealand, compared to 2,849.1kg in the UK.
Researchers said the style of farming in New Zealand is considered to be less intensive than in Britain because of the large areas of land.

Like I said, the solution would be to tax carbon equivalent everywhere. Like we do with VAT, we could have a "Greenhouse Added Tax".

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 06:14:24 AM EST
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'Carbon Content Tax' (none / 1)

to follow the VAT model, companies should pay CCT on any product they sell, but would get the right to refunds for what they buy - that would help enforcement, like for VAT.

And that would make it easy to impose on imports as well.

Now to define 'carbon content' of a good or service...

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 06:18:23 AM EST
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Re: 'Carbon Content Tax' (none / 0)

Now to define 'carbon content' of a good or service...

It's not the carbon content of the good or service, but the amount of carbon-equivalent of the greenhouse gases released by the production process. But this would make it tricky to tax automotive fuel for private consumption. But, in the case of final products the consumer can be charged for the expected environmental impact at the time of purchase, not from actual environmental impact at a later date.

Note that generally the 'carbon content' of the inputs is higher than the carbon content of the outputs of a production process, and the difference is released.

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 06:33:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: 'Carbon Content Tax' (none / 0)

One could take a sample "good" and incinerate it, and measure the concentration of various greenhouse gases.

For services, the entire carbon content of the inputs is released as the inputs are consumed.

Now I'm thinking that in this model cow farts are a good way to avoid taxation. So if the carbon tax were high enough it would become economically efficient to use animals instead of motor vehicles for agricultural work and local transport. It would be an amusing return of the horse and ox economy.

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 06:43:05 AM EST
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Re: 'Carbon Content Tax' (none / 1)

Good idea. How about carousel fraud?

(Also see the delightful description in the VAT article of the British judicial system.)

With high-CCT-value items like oil, it seems you could make a fortune through carefully timed bankrupcy.

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sapere aude

by Number 6 on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 09:11:38 AM EST
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Re: On distance (none / 1)

This has been brought up here before. I haven't time to go into it in detail, but it sounds self-serving to me. What may be true about it is that NZ lamb is an extensive land-use product. But there is not that much intensive about European lamb production either.

And what is not stated is that NZ lamb, from wool-bearing breeds (Merinos-type) is lower quality than European lamb. Nor that the ship voyage = deep freezing. Generally, this means NZ lamb is used in mass food supply - works canteens, institutional meals, food industry ready-made meals. Few consumers will buy a frozen NZ leg of lamb rather than a fresh European one, despite the price difference.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 06:25:32 AM EST
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Re: On distance (none / 0)

So UK lamb and NZ lamb is not substitutes?

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 06:34:11 AM EST
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Re: On distance (none / 0)

No. Apples and oranges.

NZ has had a quasi-monopoly on low-quality lamb and mutton in the EU since this was negotiated as part of the UK entry package in 1973. The British Isles (that includes the Irish Republic) were pretty much set up as the main higher-quality producers to the EEC (to the immediate detriment of producers elsewhere, France for example). That situation has since settled down somewhat, since there are in fact national and regional tastes to be considered, (comparative advantage doesn't appear to take that into account), such as British lamb being fatter than French taste enjoys, or there being a market for very young lamb in Spain. So national and regional production has gradually built up again.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 07:20:55 AM EST
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Re: On distance (none / 0)

NZ has had a quasi-monopoly on low-quality lamb and mutton in the EU since this was negotiated as part of the UK entry package in 1973.

!!!

there are in fact national and regional tastes to be considered, (comparative advantage doesn't appear to take that into account)

Yes, comparative advantage only works for perfectly substitutable products.

What you're describing is monopolictic competicion where producers specialise in slightly different products and either take advantage of consumer preferences or hope for them to develop.

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 07:56:20 AM EST
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Re: On distance (none / 1)

Interesting stuff, afew.

McMutton, anyone?

-----
sapere aude

by Number 6 on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 08:43:36 AM EST
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Re: On distance (none / 0)

Who will keep the register?

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 07:38:33 AM EST
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Re: On distance (none / 0)

I don't know. Who keeps the VAT register?

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Jun 4th, 2007 at 07:58:51 AM EST
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Re: On distance (none / 0)