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go figure.
it all makes money for the contractors. doesn't matter if it makes EROEI sense, so long as the big fact cost-plus projects keep rolling in... The difference between theory and practise in practise ...
Of course, the nuclear reactors would be provided by (French) Areva, so everything remains with the family.
And notice that they would be getting ultraheavy oil (also known as tar) from the oil sands (formerly known as tar sands).
The real issue is that we have a lot of infrastructure built on gasoline that cannot be replaced overnight. Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?
They have recently asked for (or obtained?) a license to build such a plant in the US. In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
They are deploying centrifuge plants based on Urenco technology (the company Pakistan spied on to build their bomb).
But, yes, they are retiring the Georges Besse gaseous diffusion cascade and cutting their electricity bill by 20 or so. Also, they are going to be able to rev up the use of reprocessed uranium.
A quick googling gives:
And energy issues are not that complicated, really. It's just common sense and lots of little details. As it is fundamentally based on nature and material flows it's inherently more simple than some of the absurdly complex things things humans have invented, like the capitalist economy. Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
The upside being that climate change will be a far smaller issue than for example the gentlemen at the IPCC thinks. I for one don't worry that much about it anymore.
I wouldn't worry much about uranium either. The new prospecting increased reserves by 50 % in 2003-2005. If we could do that with oil and coal no one would be talking about peak oil or peak coal.
But I definitely think we must look very closely at the demand side. Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
On uranium, I found this graph: But from what I read on wikipedia, it's really not so bad. "If you know your enemies and know yourself, you will not be imperiled in a hundred battles." Sun Tzu
Then we have lots of more or less working technologies to massively extend the resource base (increased enrichment, reprocessing, breeding, sea water extraction, thorium etc).
According to peak oil guru Kenneth Deffeyes ("World Uranium Resources", by Kenneth S. Deffeyes and Ian D. MacGregor, Scientific American, January, 1980), an increase in the price of uranium by ten times will increase the supply of uranium that can be economically mined by 300 times.
The nuclear industry can pretty easily afford such prices as fuel is such a small part of total costs. In 1980 the inflation-adjusted uranium price was about $40 current per pound (and I guess this is the price Deffeyes reers too) compared to $135 today after the recent massive run-up in prices, from about $6-7 per pound at the turn of the century. To realise the 300 times potential of Deffeyes, prices must triple from current levels. Not that we really need 300 times larger reserves of uranium. Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
Still, the extreme lack of price elasticity of uranium makes oil look like a joke.
The only short term (less than 5-10 years) substitute for uranium ore is more SWU's (more intense enrichment). But I think enrichment capacity is pretty much running full bore, which is why they are building Geroges Besse II, USEC's American Centrifuge and Urenco's US centrifuge (and either AREVA is part of that or planning it's own US enrichment facility).
On top of that, the old gasseous diffusion facilities are horribly energy inefficient. Tricastin use something like 2700 MW while the replacement is going to be about 5 % of that. Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
Defined as
(Price elasticity of demand) = (price / demand) * [(change in demand) / (change in price)] Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?
In both cases, the spot exhibits near zero elasticity. But in the case of oil, it tells much of the true story, where as in the case of U, it may not be significant on the long term. Pierre
They are on the same side as the hedge funds and the U exploration company, to fuck the newcomers. And it puts Areva in a strong selling position in Europe: buy my EPR, my price, cos' if you buy Toshiba, I won't procure you rods, and I'm the only guy in town with rods. Screw you. Pierre
Buy Areva EPR= get fuel and we'll take your waste, either permanently or put in int the reprocessing backlog, effectively storing it at La Hague for decades. Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
Strange thing an oil guru says such blind things.
Think of peak oil, think of oil sands specifically. Even if the recoverable supply increases dramatically, what matters is the level of production -- and that can't be run up as fast for the lower-grade supplies. (Note that even today, recovery focuses on the very highest grades among what is characterised as recoverable.)
Another point is that once you go for lower grades, the amount of Easrth moved and the CO2 emissions associated will blow up, too.
Realistically, I think nuclear will continue stuck with modest growth, thus use the highest grades for a little longer, while industry advocates will continue to argue for their technology with the opposed claims of little environmental impact and potential expansion. *Lunatic*, n. One whose delusions are out of fashion.
But I search further, maybe he did say it about nuclear, too. *Lunatic*, n. One whose delusions are out of fashion.
On one hand, there really was an SPD politician who made that claim, but it was current party chairman Kurt Beck.
On the other hand, I find that the below referenced Öko-Institut numbers come from a study asked for by Gabriel's ministerium (the full study is here (pdf!)), which looked separately at CO2 per 1 kW electricity production and combined 2kW heat and 1kW electricity production. Only the latter comparison shows only block heating gas as better than German nuclear+oil heating, so I think Gabriel shouldn1t be the person arguing for coal beating nuclear. *Lunatic*, n. One whose delusions are out of fashion.
Specific lifecycle CO2 emissions in g/kWh = t/GWh:
Subbituminous coal power plant: 1153 Bituminous coal power plant with imported coal: 949 Subbituminous coal heating plant: 729 Bituminous coal heating plant with imported coal: 622 Natural gas combined cycle power plant: 428 Natural gas combined cycle heating plant: 148 Nuclear power plant (uranium imported only from South Africa), without spent fuel storage: 126 Multicristalline solar cell (with current energy supply for manufacturing): 101 Natural gas block heating power plant: 49 Hydroelectric power: 40 Nuclear power plant (present resource use in Germany), without spent fuel storage: 32 Solar electricity import from Spain: 27 On-shore wind: 24 Off-shore wind: 23 Biogas block heating power plant: -409[Typo?] *Lunatic*, n. One whose delusions are out of fashion.
-409[Typo?]
No, not a typo.
That's an actual number coming out from a completely fucked-up model meant to give the desired numbers, in that case, extol the virtues of heat/power cogeneration, using an argument I just cannot understand. Makes no fucking sense. See the explanatory paper
When comparing electricity-only options like nuclear, wind etc. with combined heat and power (CHP) generation (i.e. cogeneration), one must deal with the additional non-electric - but still useful - heat output supplied by the cogeneration system. To do so, first the total CO2 emissions of the cogeneration system (i.e. the emissions from generating both electricity and heat) are determined. Then, the emissions of a heating system delivering the same amount of heat are subtracted ("credited"), because the cogeneration system not only generates electricity, but also replaces heat supply from another system - say, an oil heater - and, hence, replaces also its emissions. For example, the production of 1 kWh of electricity in a gas-fired internal combustion engine (ICE) cogenerator substitutes about 2 kWh of heat which does not have to be produced separately. The CO2 emissions thus saved are credited to the cogeneration system.
For example, the production of 1 kWh of electricity in a gas-fired internal combustion engine (ICE) cogenerator substitutes about 2 kWh of heat which does not have to be produced separately. The CO2 emissions thus saved are credited to the cogeneration system.
How do they compute that credit for the heat? Compared to burning coal to generate the same heat?
If they want to compared on a CHP basis, they need to compare the total output of a biomass cogeneration to the output other sources would require in electricity to also generate that heat. It will probably make the biomass cogen look extra double plus good but, fuck, going negative on CO2 emission is an amazing "methodology". Nothing is CO2 negative unless it collects CO2 in the atmosphere and buries it in the ground. Nice way to spin numbers. This is gold-plated bullshit of the first order.
For what it's worth (no details either), a UK parliamentary report gives nuclear at parity with wind.
About the figure for nuclear power, as the Öko-Institut doesn't give the break-down in the explanatory paper, I would assume it's the same joke as the very entertaining Wise Uranium numbers which, for enrichment, assume both the most energy-expensive enrichment process (gaseous diffusion) and the worst way of supplying that energy (low efficiency coal plant).
The coal assumption has a veneer of validity for the USEC plant in Paducah, Ky as it's powered by TVA electricity which is in part, generated by coal, the rest coming from hydro (Hoover Dam, etc) and nuclear. But, an other example, the EURODIF gaseous plant uses off-peak electricity from the 4 Tricastin PWR reactors. That demonstrates that the enrichment phase can be CO2 free and that nothing specifically requires the use of fossil fuel for it, as opposed to, for instance, open pit mining where the trucks are fueled with diesel (yet shaft mining machines run mostly on electricity so ...).
And anyway, USEC and EURODIF are moving to centrifuge so those CO2 numbers are obsolete in any case and at least a 20x factor off not matter how the energy is produced.
As I'm cross-checking the Wise numbers, I note that the Wise slide has this comment:
The CO2 emissions increase considerably with decreasing ore grades, but are still by far lower than from electricity generation in fossil plants. These figures cover only the operation of the fuel cycle facilities. The situation may change, if CO2 emissions from construction and decommissioning also are taken into account.
These figures cover only the operation of the fuel cycle facilities. The situation may change, if CO2 emissions from construction and decommissioning also are taken into account.
Emphasis mine. I love the ominous "caveat" about construction and decommissioning. "The situation may change..." Yeah, really? Can they show a credible scenario where building and destroying a nuclear plant would significantly alter the CO2 balance?
For reference, a 1,600 MW EPR reactor requires 250,000 m3 of concrete, about 200,000 t of cement if it's all high compressive strength concrete, that is 250,000 t CO2 (1.25 t CO2 for 1 t cement on bad days).
There are other sources for CO2 building a plant - transporting all the stuff on and off site, etc. - but, at least, that quick calculation gives an order of magnitude for the most obvious CO2 suspect - concrete in the plant. If the life cycle of an EPR plant emits more than 2 million ton of CO2 excluding the fuel cycle itself, someone needs to show me a detailed, fully sourced analysis.
And an EPR will produce 80 to 100 GWa_e over its lifetime, so reducing those hypothetical 2 million ton of CO2 to each GWa_e, that's a 25,000 t CO2 increment to the 300,000 t to 600,000 t CO2 per GWa_e numbers given by Wise for the front-end fuel cycle.
In other words, their little innuendo is 100% bullshit. They can't demonstrate their point so they punt to an unevaluated issue, knowing most will swallow it without asking questions.
For the rest of the slide, I don't know where their numbers are coming from but given what shows up when I look at the enrichment numbers, I'm entitled to have my doubts.
There's no direct URL for the slide I refer to. Watch the whole slide show for yourself. If you select all chapters, the slide in question is #67, next to last.
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Dodo, that's the problem with all those "green" think tanks. They tweak and spin the numbers to match the goal. Everywhere you peek, you find enormous claims, gross obfuscation and numerical hierophancy at every corner and when you cross-check, the balloon pops invariably.
And compared to other offenders like Greenpeace, Wise is positively tame. Given the bull they pull on CHP, I suspect that Öko-Institut is more in the Greenpeace league.
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