European elections? Why European ? What's European about them? | 19 comments (19 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: European elections (none / 1)

I see pros and cons to European parties, as much as in the current system, but I would like to know what NE stands for and who the candidates are before I recommend anything.

The NE site seems to have a problem and reloads continuously, so I couldn´t get much info. Would you add links in English, please? And maybe add the links to any previous posts here to get the full picture.

Thanks.

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.

by metavision on Sat Jan 3rd, 2009 at 06:53:08 PM EST

Re: European elections (none / 1)

Agreed. In principle, I agree with the idea of a pan European party,but that doesn't absolve it from having to have a coherent policy platform which people can debate and agree or disagree with.

Are Newropeans in favour of Lisbon, social market, common taxation systems?

I could see the Newropean party - the blues - becoming the new greens of European politics - initially including quite a wide range of ideological positions, but focusing on blue rather than green issues as their core values and unifying factors.

Are you planning to run candidates only in Germany and Italy?

What about the Libertas stated intention to run in 27 countries?

notes from no w here

by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Sat Jan 3rd, 2009 at 08:06:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: European elections (4.00 / 2)

Frank Schnittger:

What about the Libertas stated intention to run in 27 countries?

Does it have any organisation outside Ireland? Otherwise, it is not going to happen.

Sweden's finest (and perhaps only) collaborative, leftist e-newspaper Synapze.se

by A swedish kind of death on Sun Jan 4th, 2009 at 08:01:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: European elections (none / 1)

I think it is a mixture of hubris and pious aspiration, but they will try to build alliances with like minded nationalist and neo-liberal groups however small and then blame "euroregulations" and bureaucracy for preventing them from running candidates everywhere - forgetting of course - as this diary make clear - that the conduct of elections is entirely a national prerogative with the EU playing almost no regulatory role.

notes from no w here

by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Sun Jan 4th, 2009 at 08:51:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: European elections (4.00 / 3)

Hi Franck and all,

Thanks for your comments. It seems indeed Newropeans' website had some rest today, maybe because we're sunday...
But here I found the link towards Newropeans' programme here:
http://www.newropeans.eu/spip.php?article=22&lang=en

but Newropeans' core programme to democratize the European Union is really the 'heart' of Newropeans' project. Our goal is to democratize the EU, and this is a full job to do over the next decade at least...
So here are Newropeans' 16 proposals to democratize the EU here:
http://www.newropeans.eu/spip.php?article=68&lang=en

Now regarding this small foreword I can answer your questions.
Lisbon, Newropeans is against the EU constitution which is exactly the same thing than the treaty of Lisbon because people voted now in 3 countries... and probably more if you consider that National parliaments don't represent well people in lots of European countries... See the Parliament in France who agreed to the EU constitution at 90% when French people voted against..

Social market. Newropeans wants to preserve the European social model as Europeans people want!

Common taxation system: Newropeans is in favor of a European tax directly paid by European citizens to finance the EU. This would not be a tax in more but a new way to finance the EU, make European citizen feel directly involved in the EU, and prevent this kind of wild deals one can see between national governments at the last 2007 - 2013 budget voting!? Governments and national parties are only behaving egoistically to preserve their self national interests.. nothing more..

And when they play the game of the EU it's only to state then than they have no choice but to go in the way Brussels decided while they've been directly associated through the European Council and with the European commission to these European laws and directives..
Newropeans is totally opposed to this decide without people way of proceeding!! And one of its 16 proposals is to give the EU parliament the right of initiative to propose laws. Which is the only right of the European Commission (which is also part of the executive power in Europe, another unique situation in our European democracies...)

We're planning to run in several countries, candidates have already been elected for Germany and Italy for collecting signatures reason.. others candidates will be announced in the weeks to come for France, Belgium, Spain, Netherlands, Austria, Slovenia, Czech Republic and Slovakia

by David (dcarayol at yahoo.fr) on Sun Jan 4th, 2009 at 03:52:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: European elections (none / 1)

Many thanks. I'm not sure I agree with your opposition to Lisbon and to requiring a majority by referendum in each 27 member states because the requirement for unanimity makes all change and adaptation to changed circumstances all put impossible.

However I would be happy with a referendum in all 27 member stares if (say) a two thirds majority of citizens and a four fifths majority of member states was all that were required for constitutional change.

It is not sufficiently democratic to give e.g. Malta - a right to block all change - that tilts the balance too far towards conservatism and stasis.

However we do desperately need greater popular involvement in decision making and so the idea of popular referenda in all 27 member states is a good one - provided 51% of Malta is not sufficient to block all change.

notes from no w here

by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Sun Jan 4th, 2009 at 04:08:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: European elections (4.00 / 2)

Hi Frank,

Here is the content of Newropeans' proposal on the trans-european referendum:

2. Ratify systematically the main changes of community treaties, and in particular enlargements by trans-European referenda.

To allow citizens to decide the main future orientations of the EU
to avoid having an elite, disconnected from the citizens and peoples, impose its choices. These trans-European referenda will use a double majority in order to ensure democratic respect of minorities: more than 50% of the votes cast across the whole of the EU and more than 50% of the Member States voting in favour would be necessary to secure passage of a proposal.

As you can see one country can not block the others.
best
David

by David (dcarayol at yahoo.fr) on Sun Jan 4th, 2009 at 04:47:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: European elections (none / 0)

Hi David,

Many thanks. If anything, your proposal will be unacceptable to some smaller member states, for precisely the opposite reason! I.e. it reduces their power of veto too much!

The big problem with ANY change right now is that it requires the unanimous agreement of ALL member states (however their view is arrived at - by plebiscite, or by parliament) and there is no credible reason why smaller member states should agree to the removal of their veto powers when that is the one power that places them on a par with larger states.

In a perverse way, the Irish NO to Lisbon campaign, whilst claiming to want a more democratic EU, actually want a LESS Democratic EU, and oppose Lisbon because it provides for greater weighted majority voting, and greater consolidation of powers at President of the Council and EU High Representative for CFSP level.

The President of the Council is currently rotated between ALL member states on the basis of Equality. Under Lisbon, it might be expected that both posts will be dominated by nominees from the larger states.

So the problem becomes: If the EU cannot secure agreement even for the minor increases in weighted majority voting and strengthening of EU institutions as contained in Lisbon, what chance is there of achieving unanimity on the double majority system you propose?

notes from no w here

by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Sun Jan 4th, 2009 at 05:29:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: European elections (none / 1)

I would like to kindly notice that, if you consider the referenda in the 3 countries which voted for the EU Constitution as one pan-european election, then the treaty should be approuved, because the sum of Yes vote has been higher than the no vote when adding the 3 countries together.

That would indeed be an actual european decision...

PS: I know that a lot of french left wing parties are quite sensitive to the debate on the constitution. I feel it wrong, because a constitution is only what people make out of it, with or without an actual text or document. If you consider important to defend a specific policy on that point, that's up to you. But i feel you energy would be much better used elsewhere.

by Xavier in Paris on Sun Jan 4th, 2009 at 04:12:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: European elections (none / 1)

Hi Xavier and merci for your comment

This vote was not pan-european, there were distincts votes not even referendum in 80% of the members states... These votes were made by parliamentaries which in their majority voted yes when (like forecast in France, Holland, Ireland, Germany... ) when people were in majority against!?
A Newropeans' request would have been to have a referendum the same day in all member states with the same question, YES or NO, as a treaty like enlargments are important decisions for which Europeans have to be consulted.
Not sure the constitution would have been more successful this way... and if yes then Newropeans would have been in favor of it.. because people would have decided to vote YES! Simple.. Democracy..
No more no less... no left or right approach... just democracy.
Best
David

by David (dcarayol at yahoo.fr) on Sun Jan 4th, 2009 at 04:55:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: European elections (none / 0)

My question is a bit more precise: If such an election took place, would you yield to the global result, whichever results the local vote in your own country had been.

If yes, then welcome to a truly pan european federal state (and election).

If not, you're simply transferring the usual government veto mode to a more popular basis, without modifying the way Europe is considered (and decided upon).

I don't know where your party is located, but I feel that in France, a lot of left wing parties are positioned on the second one, which is no different than the classical euroskeptic defense of unanimity.

by Xavier in Paris on Mon Jan 5th, 2009 at 10:54:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: European elections (4.00 / 3)

Found some info on wikipedia.

Newropeans - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Policies
Newropeans calls for increased democratisation of the EU. They want an elected Union government, the ratification of changes to EU treaties by referendum and a unified immigration policy. Its programme is also in favour of decentralisation and restructuring of the institutions which are mainly concentrated in Brussels, but also spread among Strasbourg and Luxembourg. The party wants to ground the European Union Budget on a direct tax instead of contributions by the treasuries of member states, and opposes the lifelong judicial immunity granted to EU officials. According to the official website, the party focuses mainly on reform of the EU system, and has currently little agenda beyond that.

And from there an official blog.

Newropeans in London - transnational european political movement for the democratisation of the EU - european party

La SALAMANDRE
Newropeans Newsletter
November 2007

Not updated since 2007.

So, I would say good goals (from wikipedia), and do give Newropeans a helping hand in registering so that they can at least run somewhere. And Harald, update the site and at links from there to sites needing signatures for registering.

Sweden's finest (and perhaps only) collaborative, leftist e-newspaper Synapze.se

by A swedish kind of death on Sun Jan 4th, 2009 at 08:36:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: European elections (4.00 / 3)

Thank you for your wishes..
Our group in London was not the most active.. you know english people are not the most pro-european people...

by David (dcarayol at yahoo.fr) on Sun Jan 4th, 2009 at 03:54:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]

European elections? Why European ? What's European about them? | 19 comments (19 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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