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As gk said. Frankfurt Hbf is another terminal station where almost all long-distance trains (be them ICE or loco-pulled IC/EC) change direction, but don't end their run, and thus the time is short. Also true for most trains in Stuttgart Hbf, andmany in Munich Hbf.

To complicate matters, in Germany, many long-distance trains run in circuitous routes -- e.g. a train may run a big half-circle from Berlin through Dortmund Frankfurt, Stuttgart to Munich, then go North through Nuremburg to Hamburg; or alternatively through Leipzig back to Berlin... and in such a case, the "terminal station" is a matter of choice.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.

by DoDo on Fri Apr 17th, 2009 at 11:26:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Uhh, and sorry for a very belated reply, didn't catch it.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Fri Apr 17th, 2009 at 11:27:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That was the discussion on the Caltrain HSR compatibility blog ... if the TBT is used as a through-service terminal rather than as a route terminus, at least when trains are turning around, its not the platforms that are a bottleneck, but rather the requirement to offer 5 minute headways to the HSR.


I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.
by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Fri Apr 17th, 2009 at 07:06:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
But, NOT using it as a terminal station is pretty stupid, aint' it.

On one hand, from the passengers' point of view, it will be a terminal station -- meaning that all passengers of the arriving train will get off, and all passengers on the departing train will board there. You can't use the 6 minute turns in Frankfurt as example for that -- 10-15 minutes in Vienna Westbahnhof is more like it.

Then, you'd have to service trains in LA after a full turn (that would be up to 7 hours 20 minutes without servicing, with runs in 213-minute train pattern #3 both ways), or devise an operation plan in which runs from LA to SF are always followed by a run from SF to Merced, where there would be time for servicing.

All in all, I have a very bad feeling about this TBT project. The seeds of several future problems will be planted, even with the improvements you sketch in the second and third diaries.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.

by DoDo on Sat Apr 18th, 2009 at 04:57:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]
... four platforms and 15 minute turns permits 12tph with a 5 minute time buffer for each turn.

The TBT project will, of course, be studied in future years as an vestige of the Kamikaze Century, when the location of bus ramps onto a road bridge could determine the location of what was supposed to be the main rail hub of a city like San Francisco ... because the rail hub part of it was tacked on as something that sounded good, with the plan of getting trains in and out left for later.


I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sat Apr 18th, 2009 at 07:13:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
... capacity is much less of an issue at the Southern end, because as the system builds out, it becomes a "Y", with an Anaheim terminus and a San Diego terminus (well, its an "X" including Sacramento, but with the bulk of northbound routes heading to the San Jose / San Francisco side). Anaheim platforms are at grade, and they are building the platforms to the CHSRA request, while if the San Diego terminus is at the Airport, that will be able to act as a through platform when needed to avoid getting bottlenecked.


I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.
by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Sat Apr 18th, 2009 at 01:57:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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