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the ad hominums and insults that JakeS began engaging in

The only thing he did was calling you an astroturfer and a troll. Everything else was pretty factual.

By laying out pros and cons we risk inducing people to join the debate, and losing control of a process that only we fully understand. - Alan Greenspan

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon Jun 7th, 2010 at 05:14:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I don't remember calling him a troll. I troll-rated some of his comments because he accused me of supporting the siege of Gaza. It was shergald who asked (perhaps rhetorically) if he was a troll. To which I replied with an ambiguous "if the shoe fits..."

I stand by my calling astroturf, though. Incessant posting of un- or mis-attributed third-party content, without appropriate markup and to several different sites (the deleted diary appeared at Booman, OpenLeft and here, in completely identical versions, with the same erroneous attribution and with no notification whatsoever in any of those places that they were being crossposted) and insisting on putting them in the place where they will get the highest possible profile to casual visitors, rather than where they will fit into the way the community works, are all indicators of a person who is using the site, as opposed to contributing to it.

Astroturf is as astroturf does.

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Mon Jun 7th, 2010 at 08:12:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]
No you did call me a troll, but it was Oui that you troll-rated. I really hope that Oui comes back to ET.

But we agree that we have not seen this kind of behavior, diary police actions, slamming diarists, diary hijacking, and the like, since we were both on Daily Kos. There it was principally unleashed by groups of right wing Zionists (which is how I referred to them), GIYUS operatives and the like. But it was interesting nonetheless. Only it was unexpected if pretty low-brow and anti-intellectual from otherwise smart people. That's right, isn't it?

by shergald on Mon Jun 7th, 2010 at 09:35:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
What happened here is that myself and a couple of the current and former frontpagers of this community finally got fed up with your persistent violations of several items of the user guidelines and your unconstructive and disruptive attitude and called you on them. You then provided thirty-odd examples of unconstructive and disruptive attitude, before finally disappearing the whole sordid story down the memory hole.

You call that "diary policing." Most other people around here call it "quality control," an application of which was long overdue in this case.

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Mon Jun 7th, 2010 at 10:35:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]
" a couple of the current and former frontpagers of this community finally got fed up with your persistent violations of several items of the user guidelines and your unconstructive and disruptive attitude and called you on them."

You and/or Migeru, the two of you who hijacked my diary, will really have to document for me and everyone else, these two points because quite frankly, I do now believe you are just full of crap, a liar. So point to the diaries and comments that you say conformed to these points, that made the both of you decide to trash me and my diary for over two hours, and have continued to do so on this tread, an incredibly stupid thing to do.

by shergald on Mon Jun 7th, 2010 at 10:53:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]
You've got a lot of chutzpah calling for documentation from other people after flinging around baseless accusations all day and never providing a single scrap of evidence (nevermind having the common courtesy to actually provide a link to the diary you critiqued at one point). But as it happens, I did collect a couple of examples earlier. Not all of them are yours, and there are plenty more of yours that would qualify.

In point of fact, I'd like you to pick any one of your diaries, and we can match it against any one of mine, Migeru's, Colman's, afew's, Jerome's or Crazy Horse's.

I'm betting € to Zim$ that you're gonna come up short in that comparison.

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Mon Jun 7th, 2010 at 11:06:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]
since you deleted it, but I have no qualms whatsoever stating that I believe - and fully support - JakeS and Migeru's description of what happened, because it is consistent with their behavior, fundamentally based on requesting evidence and sources for assertions and questioning all assumptions.

Wind power
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 at 03:49:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]
i may not be an unbiased party, but i did read the thread completely, in fact right up to the moment it was deleted (i had just commented for the first time.)

i was almost offended by shergald's lack of understanding, or willingness to accept another's views.  that's enough from me.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 at 04:03:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
"What happened here is that myself and a couple of the current and former frontpagers of this community finally got fed up with your persistent violations of several items of the user guidelines and your unconstructive and disruptive attitude and called you on them. You then provided thirty-odd examples of unconstructive and disruptive attitude, before finally disappearing the whole sordid story down the memory hole.

You call that "diary policing." Most other people around here call it "quality control," an application of which was long overdue in this case."

- Jake

The persistent violations of several items of the user guidelines and unconstructive and disruptive attitude, were said to have prompted the attack. I asked for documentation from past diaries and comments, and none was forthcoming, precisely because nothing like this can be substantiated. So I disagree with them and believe it was a trumped up charge.

by shergald on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 at 09:35:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Dude. I linked to a comment containing three examples from you. You know what a link is, right? It's that blue highlighted text that you can click on.

Then I went AFK, and you flamed out and went into a tailspin with three or four increasingly incoherent and insulting screeds, which the frontpagers mercifully decided to hide from view. Presumably to protect what little good repute you have left.

But let's take it once again for heritor-prince Knud: Improper use of third-party content, undeclared crossposting and conspiracy theory peddling.

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 at 10:26:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]
So you hid the comments that challenged to you to provide documentation of accusations you made, which were entirely false.

You also hid the comment in which I reminded you that two years ago you complained to Jerome about IP diaries on the site. As as far as I can tell, you have put together, as you admitted, a group of frontpagers, two anyway, that decided to hijack my diary, engage in ad hominum attacks, insults (troll, Oui a pompous prick), and false assertions, like those above.

Your obvious agenda is to get IP off the frontpage. I can only suspect your motives, but we shall see if you succeed.

by shergald on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 at 01:07:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
JakeS can't hide comments. That was afew. Try and keep your _dramatise personae _ straight.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 at 01:15:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]
[ET Moderation Technology™]

I hid your comments in this thread. JakeS has no means of doing so (or hiding any other comments), he is not a member of the editorial team.

The accusation that there is an agenda to get Israel-Palestine off the front page is totally baseless. You were invited before to look at another diary on the subject by the stormy present, it's not just about the ships, to see what JakeS has to say there. I suggest you do so.

This discussion must end here. Any further rancorous comments -- on either side -- will be simply deleted.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 at 01:15:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
This is not rancorous. But JakeS has never once commented on any of my diaries, so I don't think I would care to attend to his at this point.

And it was Jake who kept suggesting that my diaries should go into the Salon, or be represented by a newspaper headline with link.

I also did ask you and Migeru to substantiate the false charges Jake made. He won't; he can't.

by shergald on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 at 01:27:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
shergald:
I don't think I would care to attend to his

Not his diary, the stormy present's. But if you don't want to see, keep your eyes shut.

Now let's end this.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 at 01:37:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]
[ET Moderation Technology™]

Comment by JakeS deleted.

End of discussion.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 at 01:40:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
[ET Moderation Technology™]

A further comment by shergald was deleted too. Any further attempt to prolong this discussion will result in comments on this thread being closed.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Jun 8th, 2010 at 04:31:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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