The End of the European Dream | 276 comments (274 topical, 2 editorial, 0 hidden)

Agree. My sentiments to a T.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Sun May 8th, 2011 at 02:46:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Me four. I'm basically an optimist but can't find much rational basis for that insane optimism right now - except that Yurp has overcome even greater challenges in the past. The problem is that the EPP has become so dominant, and the PES so slavishly subservient to EPP talking points even EPP leaders don't really believe. When you look to the IMF dfor (relative) sanity, you know you have a problem...

Index of Frank's Diaries

by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Sun May 8th, 2011 at 03:24:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yurp (4.00 / 4)

Has there ever been a socio-economic project as large as the European Union before? Half a billion people using (officially) 23 languages, and representing a diverse range of cultures.

While the evolution of the EU has taken place over 60 odd years, it was only in 1993 that the Single Market was born, with its 4 basic principles of the freedom of movement of people, goods, services and money. That was only 17 years ago: Europe is still a teenager (like the Internet).

Remarkably too, the EU is administered cost-effectively - contrary to popular opinion.

Enormous problems remain - that's what ET was set up to discuss. But problems have to be solved, and we are all part of that process. To me, the major task, deep down, is how to balance regulation with creative and cultural freedom.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Sun May 8th, 2011 at 05:15:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yurp (4.00 / 4)

Oh, the EU is doing quite well, all things considered. At this point in the history of the US, they were fighting an acrimonious civil war. And it turned out to survive. So federations that survive often have constitutional crises that make this one look like kid's play.

But federations that do not survive also often have constitutional crises that do not even approach the severity of the current one.

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun May 8th, 2011 at 05:45:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yurp (4.00 / 4)

Has there ever been a socio-economic project as large as the European Union before? Half a billion people using (officially) 23 languages, and representing a diverse range of cultures.

India?

Economics is politics by other means

by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon May 9th, 2011 at 02:01:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yurp (none / 0)

Good point - though it was more of a disunion project.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Mon May 9th, 2011 at 02:40:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yurp (none / 0)

Back in the days of the EU Constitution debate I suggested one should look at India and Switzerland as case studies in multilingual devolved democracy.

Economics is politics by other means

by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon May 9th, 2011 at 05:43:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yurp (none / 0)

Today, do you consider them useful case studies?

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Mon May 9th, 2011 at 04:38:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yurp (4.00 / 3)

Is it just me or the (current) optimism of EuroTrib members about Yurp is proportional to the credit rating of their home nations?

by cagatacos on Mon May 9th, 2011 at 08:51:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yurp (4.00 / 2)

Also possibly to their age.

Economics is politics by other means

by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Mon May 9th, 2011 at 09:00:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yurp (none / 0)

It's certainly not proportional to my personal credit rating. :)

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Mon May 9th, 2011 at 09:04:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yurp (none / 1)

In my case, i didn't give a thought as to various credit ratings. Nor to all the delusional religious psychopathy about economics.

i was pontificating from my tunnel vision watching Germany, Denmark, Sweden, the Netherlands and Spain (and soon Finland) selling their wind turbines and technology around the world, including into the US, UK and the BRICs. I think about Spanish and German solar plant the same way, although there California has given the US a base of its own.

Then i was thinking of the growth in organic produce in parts of Europe. And a general attitude regarding sustainability.

More likely my view is based upon grandiose doses of wishful thinking, which i spend most every day trying to make good.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Mon May 9th, 2011 at 11:11:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Yurp (none / 1)

You see optimism somewhere?

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Mon May 9th, 2011 at 04:39:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

The End of the European Dream | 276 comments (274 topical, 2 editorial, 0 hidden)

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