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In the Eurozone as a whole, there are five surplus sinks: Germany, the Netherlands, Austria, Luxembourg and Finland.

The rest are surplus sources, and the external account is balanced.

Therefore, any surplus generated by the deficit countries will eventually find its way to the five surplus sinks.

Germany is larger than the other four by a factor of what? Four? Five? Something like that, anyway.

The fact that the Greek sovereign primary deficit passed through Italy before ending up at Siemens and Rheinmetall AG is of no consequence to the conclusion that it did, in fact, end up there.

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun Feb 19th, 2012 at 05:37:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]
We follow this logic the greek primary deficit financed chinese exports.
by IM on Sun Feb 19th, 2012 at 05:55:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]
No, the Eurozone has balanced foreign accounts.

RoW is not a surplus sink for the Eurozone, which means that none of the money the Eurozone's members pay for import end up in China.

The notion that "China is bankrolling Europe" is American conventional wisdom that you're puking up as if it were fact.

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun Feb 19th, 2012 at 06:05:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The notion that "China is bankrolling Europe" is American conventional wisdom that you're puking up as if it were fact.

I said nothing of the sort. Don't make things up.

I cuold have used Ireland. Or the Netherlands. But countries with a considerable trade surplus with Germany. Or Japan.

by IM on Sun Feb 19th, 2012 at 06:10:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
No.

The Eurozone has balanced foreign accounts. RoW is therefore not a surplus sink for the Eurozone. RoW not being a surplus sink, and China belonging to RoW, China cannot be a surplus sink.

This is elementary graph theory. So elementary, in fact, that you can prove it simply by drawing a graph with the nodes "Greece," "rest of Eurozone" and "Rest of World."

Then impose the boundary conditions that inflows must exceed outflows for Greece, and that all in- and outflows to RoW must sum to zero.

The only sink in that graph is RoE. China is not in the Eurozone, and is therefore not a sink.

Q.e.d.

This has been your first and last fee lesson in elementary graph theory. If anything here is unclear, look it up before venturing into discussions of international trade again.

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun Feb 19th, 2012 at 06:25:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That, as so often from you is nonsense. Even after we factor out the eurozone, Greece is not running a balanced trade account with the rest of world.
by IM on Sun Feb 19th, 2012 at 06:30:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
sigh

The Eurozone is running a balanced trade with RoW.

That means that the Greek deficit cannot end up in a sink outside the Eurozone. It. Is. Not. Possible.

As long as the Eurozone as a whole is running balanced foreign accounts, all Eurozone countries' aggregate deficits must end up as surpluses for other Eurozone countries.

This is not a difficult concept to grasp, so I really don't see why you continue this obtuse insistence that German surpluses are not the problem.

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun Feb 19th, 2012 at 06:47:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]
You keep (deliberately?) forgetting Greece is part of a currency union with aggregate balanced external trade.

Greece doesn't have a problem with its debt in Yuan either.

tens of millions of people stand to see their lives ruined because the bureaucrats at the ECB don't understand introductory economics -- Dean Baker

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sun Feb 19th, 2012 at 06:06:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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