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I'm more and more convinced that the primary aim of the LDs has always been to keep Labour out of power. They'll use any pretext to help that, and Brexit is an exceedingly effective one.

Remain on FB is currently being carpet-bombed by "Labour is a Brexit Party" posts, which suggests a handy false equivalence between Labour's nuanced - and probably unachievable, certainly without a PV - Brexit goals, and Tory/TBP Fuck You No Deal.

And it's working. Farage is set to walk it, and of course that puts No Deal back on the table.

It's hard to work out which LDs are paid trolls and which are just a bit stupid and gullible, but fanatically zealous in their self-harming pursuit of a Remain result that will make No Deal more likely.

Of course I could be wrong about all of this, but I'm really not seeing how "The Remain Party" coming a distant second to "The Brexit Party" helps Remain in any way.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Mon May 20th, 2019 at 10:59:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Criticising Lib Dems for being Lib Dems and trying to maximise their vote by hoovering up disgruntled Remainers is hardly a valid criticism. If Corbyn wanted to go after Remainer votes, he knows what he has to do - unequivocally support a second referendum.

The Lib Dems are essentially a status quo party but Labour's change agenda - such as it is - is being drowned out by the Brexit issue which currently Trumps all else. With the Tories also likely to go radical no deal Brexit under a new leader, there may actually be a huge opportunity for a status quo centre ground party to replace either Labour or the Tories in the Westminster duopoly, just as the Brexit Party threatens to do to the Tories.

Corbyn has been absolutely consistent - he wants a general election and may very well get one if Boris fails to muster a Commons majority. If the Brexit party is more successful at splitting the right wing vote than the Lib Dems are at pealing off Labour supporters, then Corbyn will win that one if he promises a second referendum on any new BREXIT deal which Labour manages to negotiate. The SNP could help him make up the numbers...

He can then claim a democratic mandate for whatever the electorate decides and get on with implementing the rest of Labours anti-austerity programme.  In this scenario, the EP elections are little more than a glorified  opinion poll with the potential to almost destroy the Tories. Farage will crow that he is the next prime Minister in waiting and hard Brexiteers could desert the Tories in a general election as well.

Lots of ifs and buts, and very risky. I think he should have taken the EP elections much more seriously and offered a second referendum now. But its probably too late to make that offer now and he will just have to take a Brexit party win on the chin. The latest opinion polls put him way out in front of the Lib Dems and within striking distance of the Brexit party in any case...

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by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Mon May 20th, 2019 at 12:29:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Conservatives take power at Bolton Council as agreement reached | The Bolton News
THE Conservatives will lead Bolton Council as smaller parties make a deal to appoint David Greenhalgh as council leader.

But for the whole country. Again.

by generic on Mon May 20th, 2019 at 01:30:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
And also for the fact that according to Cable, the current LibDem Remain Masterplan seems to be to support May's Deal and hope a PV amendment attached to it will pass.

It's absolutely fair to criticise them for all of this. Of course they're playing party politics, but that's hardly an excuse when there's so much at stake.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Mon May 20th, 2019 at 01:50:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
There may be local factors at play, but the Lib Dems supporting the Conservatives to keep Labour out is not a good look when translated to the national level. It reminds voters of the Lib Dem Conservative coalition many Lib Dems would rather the voters forgot.

Index of Frank's Diaries
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Mon May 20th, 2019 at 02:09:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]


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