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"Trump and Brexit = politics on behalf of rich men."

Good grief. The woke middle class really is full of itself!

Haven't you noticed how the working class vote these days? Do you honestly believe YOU are on the side of "the workers" anymore?

That's what happened to Labour in the UK and hopefully what will happen to the Democrats in the USA.

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sapere aude

by Number 6 on Fri Jan 31st, 2020 at 09:29:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Obtaining the votes of a class of people that feel disinherited and hopeless by means of lies, manipulation, and demagogy hardly counts as supporting the "working class", does it? Or maybe it does in your book.

Things are going to slide, slide in all directions
Won't be nothing, nothing you can measure anymore
L. Cohen
by john_evans (john(dot)evans(dot)et(at)gmail(dot)com) on Fri Jan 31st, 2020 at 10:08:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
So they are stupid? They don't know what they want? But you know what's best for them?

We've been hearing this from the middle class since Marx ... or possibly since Roman times.

Try to accept the possibility that people understand the options and vote for what they want.

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sapere aude

by Number 6 on Fri Jan 31st, 2020 at 10:34:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]
https:/www.spiked-online.com/2020/01/28/terry-christian-the-true-face-of-remoaner-bigotry
"It is these prejudices against the `low-information' and `soon-to-be-dead' voters that prevented Remainers from seeing Leave voters as their democratic equals, allowing them to wage an all-out war on democracy without any semblance of guilt."


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sapere aude
by Number 6 on Fri Jan 31st, 2020 at 10:54:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Either people are always voting in their best interest, and to suggest otherwise is insulting, or they are not.

If they are, that means that they were also voting in their best interest when they chose the other way.

If they are not, then the arguments advanced in the election campaign can be compared with the outcomes and likely outcomes of the policies enacted.

I think the second way of looking at things is the correct one. That does imply that people can be tricked, but also that the real input from the demos is quite limited in these democracies of ours.

by fjallstrom on Fri Jan 31st, 2020 at 10:57:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Try to accept the possibility that they are misled about the options.

And please stop whittering about the "middle class". Are you "working class"? In what way?

Personally, I am only "middle class" by the education I was fortunate to receive in the postwar years when public policy was more favourable to the lower classes than it is today.

And excuse me, but for someone who is apparently celebrating today, you seem unaccountably angry. Why is that?

Things are going to slide, slide in all directions
Won't be nothing, nothing you can measure anymore
L. Cohen

by john_evans (john(dot)evans(dot)et(at)gmail(dot)com) on Fri Jan 31st, 2020 at 11:06:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
AFAIK more people voted for parties supporting remain/second referendum than voted for parties support Brexit, so it is the antiquated FPTP single seat constituency system which "manipulated" the result.

Also I have no difficulty in admitting the Brexit side were better financed, organised and led. They had a clear and simple message, much better populist leaders, and split the vote less. Labour and the Lib Dems simply had to work together on a common platform or all was lost, and so it transpired. Once Farage stood aside for Boris it was all over bar the shouting.

The wonder is that with such poor leadership on the Corbyn/Swinson front, that the Conservatives did not win by more.

But no one is disputing the electoral result now. At issue are different views of the consequences. Boris promises the "sunny uplands" of a revitalised UK. My belief, and the belief of most Remainers is that the long term consequences will be negative. We shall see who is proved right, and it doesn't matter whether you style yourself as working or middle class..

Index of Frank's Diaries

by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Fri Jan 31st, 2020 at 11:55:38 AM EST
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