This is how PR works.

by Colman Wed Sep 21st, 2005 at 04:34:39 PM EST

There seems to be some confusion among our friends from first-past-the-post systems about the nature of politics in a mature democracy using proportional representation systems.

Complicated coalition negotiations are normal. It's how we try to avoid giving arrogant fools and arrogant liars free rein¹ to carry out policies that they have no mandate for. Twice. What Germany has avoided here is punishing the SPD for unpopular reforms by giving power to a faction committed to even more unpopular reforms. Sounds like democracy is working. Having a result immediatly is not always a virtue.

Anyway, coalition building is a wonderful spectator sport.

Bob has a much more temperate diary along these lines.

Or "reign", as the case may be.&uarr

This is how PR works. | 10 comments (10 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: This is how PR works. (none / 0)

Perhaps best to refrain from comment until we see what the resulting coalition is--or the outcome of the follow-up election in a couple of months.

by asdf on Wed Sep 21st, 2005 at 04:53:39 PM EST

Re: This is how PR works. (none / 1)

That too is how the system works.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Wed Sep 21st, 2005 at 05:07:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

One Word: Amen (4.00 / 2)

I'm an American who believes that this would be a politically healthier country, and the world would be a safer place, if we had some form of PR. Germany is what democracy looks like.

by GreenSooner (greensooner@NOSPAMintergate.com) on Wed Sep 21st, 2005 at 05:00:53 PM EST

Re: This is how PR works. (none / 1)

Just to point out that Britain's FPTP system doesn't preclude a hung parliament, coalitions, etc.

See what Fran found here, in which the Tories speak of a possible coalition with Lib Dems in the event of a hung parliament next time round.

And, iirc, there was a possibility of a hung parliament in 1992. Opinion polls predicted a very close election, though, in the end, the Tories got a clear majority.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Sep 22nd, 2005 at 04:41:39 AM EST

FPTP and coalitions/hung parliament (none / 0)

I think the presently non-two-party systems in Britain and Canada show that only strong local traditions can keep alive a third party, strong local traditions that mean majority in some districts.

Labour in Britain could only break the previous two-party system that ruled for two centuries only because there was a massive expansion of the circle of eligible voters (adding poor people and women).

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Thu Sep 22nd, 2005 at 07:30:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is how PR works. (none / 0)

Ummm.......you do realize that the Christian Democractic party ruled uninterrupted for over fourty years under PR in Italy?? There were close to fifty governements over those forty years; absoluely extraordinary instablity combined with corruption, mafia-influence, prolifereation of parties, ad infinitum. All of this led ultimateley to Tangentopoli (probably the biggest corruption scandal in the history of Western civilization).

Italian voted overwhelmingly (about 86% in favor) to change to a predominaty majoritarian FPTP system. Things havenìt been perfect, but they have substantially improved as a result.

It is no coincedence that right now, at this very time, Berlusconi and the ex-CHRISTIAN DEMOCRATS are trying to pass a law to go back to PR!!

by gilgamesh (expat at 6719 dot it) on Thu Sep 22nd, 2005 at 05:29:14 AM EST

Re: This is how PR works. (none / 1)

Italy seems to be a special case. It often is.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu Sep 22nd, 2005 at 05:52:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is how PR works. (none / 0)

Things havenìt been perfect, but they have substantially improved as a result.

Berlusconi.

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Thu Sep 22nd, 2005 at 07:25:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is how PR works. (none / 0)

Politics in Israel has also been pretty screwed up due to influence by small extremist parties needed to make up a majority coalition.

by asdf on Thu Sep 22nd, 2005 at 09:19:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is how PR works. (none / 0)

In a FPTP system, those small parties would be embedded in major parties as party wings, and could have a weight well above their popular base by taking over positions within that party.

Witness the US Republican Party in the last six years (or sixteen).

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Fri Sep 23rd, 2005 at 08:09:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

This is how PR works. | 10 comments (10 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Go to: [ European Tribune Homepage : Top of page : Top of comments ]

This is how PR works.

Top Diaries

UNGA: West Censors the South and East

EU VDL State of the Union -- Managing Decay

Rugby World Cup 2023 Week 1 review

Reactionary Visions and eNtiTiES

Sovereignty 2040

Energy (and Other) Events Monthly - September 2023

Recent Diaries

UNGA: West Censors the South and East

A Tale by Benjamin Franklin

Fail in Democracy Return to Authoritarianism

Yemen From Ceasefire to Peace Talks?

Huge Cost Proxy War of Choice

EU VDL State of the Union -- Managing Decay

Reactionary Visions and eNtiTiES

Top Military War Planning Under Joe Biden - Ukraine

Rugby World Cup 2023 Week 1 review

Joe's Fuck the EU -- Showdown

Modi G20 One Earth, One Family, One Future

Conflict In Syria's Deir Ezzor Province

Sovereignty 2040

Some September Food/Ag Events

September 2023

The Leading International Pariah State

Energy (and Other) Events Monthly - September 2023

BREAKING: The Free State of Gabon

Ukraine Halting China's BRI Project to EU

Europe Reverts 100 Years