Welcome to European Tribune. It's gone a bit quiet around here these days, but it's still going.

Open Thread

by Upstate NY Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 05:34:18 PM EST

The threads with the eye-candy were open threads, but seem not to have met with their public... We'll try to put up "normal" open threads in the European evening from now on... J.

Consider this my request for occasional open threads on Eurotrib.

I was considering how to ask for this without starting a diary but I didn't want to pollute anyone's diary with this request.

I have been a one-trick pony of sorts on your blog with a special emphasis on Cyprus and Turkey. I have a few diaries which address both Katrina and European literature among other topics. Sometimes in perusing the Turkish and Cypriot online news sources I come across an article which I'd like to post here, but I think it's undeserving of a diary of its own. Is there a better place to link to interesting articles than a diary?

One such article can be found here: Fallout to Accession

There's a lot of bluster in the article, but if indeed this is a real danger in Turkey, I have two reactions. One, if it is entirely possible that such a dangerous authoritarian regime might take power, then Turkey is further away from integration than even I imagined. And two, maybe this warning or threat should be taken seriously since the last thing the EU needs is a belligerent neighbor. Or maybe it can all be ignored as ill-considered bluster?

How many "Open Threads" a day would you suggest?

The "site gnomes" have ongoing discussions about what is the best way to go with the site, and with the front page specifically. Some of us think fewer front page articles are better, and some of us (or...at least me) think we should have lots of front page stories, like 8-11 a day. We haven't come a final agreement on this...just "kicking it around"...but either way, we could easily add more open threads, if there is interest in this...so what's a good number?

Thanks for voicing your opinion!

"Once in awhile we get shown the light, in the strangest of places, if we look at it right" - Hunter/Garcia

by whataboutbob on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 10:55:16 AM EST
Thanks for replying WAB. Can I call you WAB?

I feel reticent to make any suggestions in deference to the blog owners. One "Open thread" in the afternoon would help.

I'll take Fran's suggestion to use EuroBreakfast for the mornings.

by Upstate NY on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 11:48:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]
One "Open thread" in the afternoon would help.

Whose afternoon?  :)

I'll second your request.  I know that the European Breakfast is an open thread, but those of us on this side of the pond are probably just settling into bed around the time that the Europeans are chatting over their croissants and cappucinos.  I know people here are pretty adept at keeping a diary alive for a reasonable amount of time.  But I bet most people don't go back and check the EB posts after a certain point in the day unless someone has responded directly to them.  

So a US afternoon/EU evening open thread seems like a good idea to me too.

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. -Voltaire

by p------- on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 03:51:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Bob is ok

"Once in awhile we get shown the light, in the strangest of places, if we look at it right" - Hunter/Garcia
by whataboutbob on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 03:51:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Basically the European Breakfast is an open thread. But I think it would be helpful to put up another open thread in the afternoon. I found myself not posting anything new on the Breakfast because it seemed to have no more reactions. And maybe another one in the evening. Ok. my 0.02 cents.
by Fran on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 11:11:56 AM EST
Upstate NY - feel free to make even short diaries if you have a story to share, it's not like we're overwhelmed yet! And diaries seem to encourage dialogue more easily than the open threads, where few seem to venture to comment yet.

(I would encourage all to join afew and Izzy and the other regulars in discussing all the items brought forward by Fran every morning. There is an amazing wealth of information in there, and lots to discuss!)

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 05:39:01 PM EST
Thanks Jerome. I guess I'm applying Kos-etiquette to your blog. There's some pressure involved in diary-dom. If you're gonna diary, you better have something interesting to say!!! At least that's the Kossack way.
by Upstate NY on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 06:07:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Porsche plans to acquire 20% stake in VW

Porsche, the world's most profitable carmaker, is planning to become the largest shareholder in Volkswagen through a stake of 20 per cent in a surprise move that will change the face of the German automotive industry.

The purchase, costing at least €3.3bn based on Friday's closing price, will help secure VW against the prospect of a hostile takeover and strengthen the independence of Porsche, a family-controlled company.

It underlines the relative financial strengths of the companies as Porsche, which sold 88,000 cars last year, takes a stake in Europe's largest carmaker, with sales of 5.1m vehicles but a loss from its main VW brand.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 06:00:46 PM EST
Are we moving toward one overlord worldwide carmaker? I just bought a Subaru WRX that has technology from a Porsche blueprint.

So, Subaru/Porsche/VW may be in bed together. Chrysler/Mercedes. Who else?

by Upstate NY on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 06:09:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Subaru is actually part of the General Motors group. Thus the recent SAABaru and India's Chevrolet Forester...
by asdf on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 08:16:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Audi also plays footsie with VW.
by Upstate NY on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 08:53:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

We must stand by the CAP
By Bertie Ahern (Prime Minister of Ireland)

Following the defeat of the European Union's proposed constitution in the French and Dutch referendums, the debate on the way forward for Europe has begun. As part of this debate, the Common Agricultural Policy has in recent months been the subject of much criticism, with repeated calls for further reform. Those who defend the CAP are accused of protecting vested interests or of being the prisoners of outdated policies.

The aims of the CAP were set down in the 1957 Treaty of Rome. Chief among these are the objectives of guaranteeing the availability of food supplies at reasonable prices and of ensuring a fair standard of living for the agricultural community. These objectives are still valid today.


Calls for radical CAP reform are misplaced and outdated; they are based on a misunderstanding of the role of the CAP in European society and the world economy; they are based on a false premise about the relative cost of the CAP; and they ignore the realities of the WTO.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes
by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 06:05:01 PM EST
Oh crap. They let Bertie out of his box.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 06:40:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, I suppose it's not too bad (though did he have to use the man-of-the-people anorak picture?).

For background, any Irish Taoiseach who didn't support CAP in the year before an election would be a very, very, very stupid man.

by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Sun Sep 25th, 2005 at 06:45:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]
US claims journo Fisk's papers "not in order," bars him from entering US to attend speaking engagement

"U.S. immigration officials refused Tuesday to allow Robert Fisk, longtime Middle East correspondent for the London newspaper, The Independent, to board a plane from Toronto to Denver. Fisk was on his way to Santa Fe for a sold-out appearance in the Lannan Foundation 's readings-and-conversations series Wednesday night. According to Christie Mazuera Davis, a Lannan program officer, Fisk was told that his papers were not in order. Davis made last-minute arrangements Wednesday for Amy Goodman, host of Pacifica Radio's daily news show, Democracy Now!, to interview Fisk via satellite from a television station in Toronto [i.e. in a free country -- DeA]..."

pshaw.  petty.  stupid.

The difference between theory and practise in practise ...

by DeAnander (de_at_daclarke_dot_org) on Mon Sep 26th, 2005 at 12:08:48 AM EST
Daily Kos: Darwin's Evolution vs Pedro the Mountain Mummy
 The mummy

    He was found in 1932 by 2 gold prospectors sitting cross-legged on a ledge in a small cave in a granite mountain 60 miles southwest of Casper, Wyoming. His hands were folded in his lap, in the timeless attitude of a Buddha. He appeared to be middle-aged. His skin was brown and wrinkled, his nose flat, the forehead low, the mouth broad and thin-lipped. And he was 14 inches tall

Bibleland vs Darwin

On February 2005 Bibleland's owner offered $10,000 for the mummy(2) Why ? Read their homepage:

    At Bibleland Studios, we believe the truth of man's origins can be found written in the book of Genesis.. We believe that 6,000 years ago we were created by God..

by lawnorder (lawnorder / texasturkey.us) on Mon Sep 26th, 2005 at 12:28:41 AM EST

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