Welcome to European Tribune. It's gone a bit quiet around here these days, but it's still going.

A revolutionary in their midst.

by Jerome a Paris Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 05:55:15 AM EST

Ce Bouton est un des mecs les mieux payés de France et il n'est même pas foutu de savoir ce qui se passe dans sa banque. A ce tarif-là, on se demande à quoi il sert.That Bouton guy is one of the best paid persons in France and he didn't know shit about what was going on in his bank. At that price, one wonders if he was even needed.
Il faut sortir d'un capitalisme sans transparence où l'innovation dans les sytèmes bancaires a conduit à donner le pouvoir aux spéculateurs plutôt qu'aux entrepreneurs.

Quand vous entendez des banquiers, ils sont toujours très fiers de leurs salles de marché. Vous savez, ces endroits où l'on prend, comme ils disent, des positions pour gagner plus en un temps record.

We have to get out of a capitalist system with no transparency, where innovations in banking have only given more power to speculators rather than entrepreneurs.

When you talk to bankers, they're always very proud of their trading rooms. You know, the places where, as they say, you make bets to earn more in record time.


The above quotes are provided by this morning's Canard Enchainé, the French weekly investigative-cum-satirical paper (sorry, no link), and they come from ... Sarkozy. Along with his public declarations on the ultimate responsibility of Bouton, Société Générale's CEO, for what happened in his bank, this will provide useful fodder for two things:

  • criticism of financial capitalism (aka neofeudalism) run amok;
  • criticism of Sarkozy himself, who awarded himself a tripling of his presidential salary a few months ago.
Along with the current highly public declarations by French PM Fillon that France "will not allow [the bank] to be the target of hostile raids", and UBS announcing another $4bn writedown (bringing the total for last year to $18bn) on its subprime exposure, things promise to keep on being "fun" in the financial sector in the near future...

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Thank you for the quote, Jerome. It was very refreshing to read. So many world "authorities" deserve the same sort of frank description.

Die kleinen Diebe hängt man, die großen lässt man laufen.
by Existentialist on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 06:45:48 AM EST
Hi, Existentialist! Welcome to ET!

"Dieu se rit des hommes qui se plaignent des conséquences alors qu'ils en chérissent les causes" Jacques-Bénigne Bossuet
by Melanchthon on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 07:03:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Thank you so very much. I guess I'll be mostly here from now on, and I'm very glad this site exists. I went to a school where the motto was "The winds of freedom blow." This seems to be that kind of place as well.

It's also very nice to see Rene Char quoted (I'll make a point of working on putting proper accent marks in from now on).

Die kleinen Diebe hängt man, die großen lässt man laufen.

by Existentialist on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 07:40:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Are you sure that you took the meaning correctly? Just kidding.

paul spencer
by paul spencer (spencerinthegorge AT yahoo DOT com) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 11:21:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
More and more every day.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
by Starvid on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 09:09:33 AM EST
Let me double check, was that sarcasm?

Just making sure.

Earth provides enough to satisfy every man's need, but not every man's greed. Gandhi

by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 09:46:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Nope. I'm a centrist which puts me further to the right and upwards in the political compass than pretty much anyone else on the ET.

By the way, I think that is one of the strongest sides of the ET. In spite of having a differing opinion on many issues, I always feel welcome here. And while people are snarky at times, they are never rude.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.

by Starvid on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 10:43:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You don't have to be a centrist to like some of the thing's he's said. For instance, I'm a fair bit away from you on the compass up there but I have to admit I liked his Guy Môquet gestures earlier on, though I would also point out that they were rather empty gestures intended to give the appearance of rassemblement more than actually doing so.

And note that this is a pattern; he leaves one thing to be understood, usually via vague phrasings, and then quite another thing (if anyting) ends up being done in this regard. And along these lines, noteworthy in Jerôme's post here is what Fillon is saying.

I'm certainly not expecting SG to be renationalised...

The Hun is always either at your throat or at your feet. Winston Churchill

by r------ on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 11:01:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I would also point out that they were rather empty gestures intended to give the appearance of rassemblement more than actually doing so.

But then I don't live in France and have to suffer the effects of his rule, but can still enjoy the newspaper articles.

Politics are, after all, the sport-pages for those of us not interested in real sports.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.

by Starvid on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 11:07:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Why nationalisation? Do Kerviel's losses put SG at risk of insolvency? I thought Sarko's concern was that the loss of market value would make it an easier target for a takeover bid by  <gasp> Italian or Spanish banks.

We have met the enemy, and he is us — Pogo
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 12:59:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Mention nationalisation because Fillon is saying no hostile takeover. Well, one way to do that (and not simply give taxpayer money to shareholders of the bank to bail them out) is to nationalise. At a discount which protects taxpayers.

No hostile foreign takeover, no moral hazard, no ripoff of taxpayers.

The Hun is always either at your throat or at your feet. Winston Churchill

by r------ on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 01:05:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]
How can i do the test?
by GreatZamfir on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 12:38:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
From here.

We have met the enemy, and he is us — Pogo
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 12:55:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
<-4.67,-3>
by GreatZamfir on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 12:57:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Did you add your score to the list at the bottom of the ET Wiki page?

We have met the enemy, and he is us — Pogo
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 01:04:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Nope, I'll try
by GreatZamfir on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 04:05:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, if someone know how to do the return to the line thing he might add mine
"margouillat" -6.75 -6.77 !

Should be near the cross-hairs !

"What can I do, What can I write, Against the fall of Night". A.E. Housman

by margouillat (hemidactylus(dot)frenatus(at)wanadoo(dot)fr) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 04:10:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Though someone's female, I'm pretty sure.

I'm in a great white space on the bottom right of the lower left quadrant.

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 06:30:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Thank you... I don't know if it was you or somebody else as with those aliases I don't really know (nor care) about the gender thing !
From time to time I discover through postings that such one is of such gender, otherwise I wouldn't have a clue :-)

I tried to get it in myself, but couldn't get it properly "under", maybe a safari thing ?

"What can I do, What can I write, Against the fall of Night". A.E. Housman

by margouillat (hemidactylus(dot)frenatus(at)wanadoo(dot)fr) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 07:11:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I'm just joking about someone, who is here to confuse us all.

Could be a Safari thing, in firefox it was easy enough (enter and then one space)

by nanne (zwaerdenmaecker@gmail.com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 03:36:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well then that leaves me baffled.

You claim to be a centrist, he's extreme right, and you say you like him more and more?

Hell, I'm so centrist I am a member of the centrist party in France and I rate Sarkozy as the worst thing to happen to France since it got invaded in 1940...

Or maybe the compass could use some calibrating and 0,0 really is neo-liberalism and neo-conservatism (pretty median in corridors of power these days mind you).

Earth provides enough to satisfy every man's need, but not every man's greed. Gandhi

by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 04:13:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The man is a populist gaullist, not Franco reborn. I still haven't found anything to disagree on with him (but I'm sure you guys could find something for me).

I like the foreign policy, the lamented labour market reforms are things we did 20 years ago, the positive view on certain State intervention in the markets and the tough-on-crime stuff are things we should emulate. And his flamboyant theatrics are entertaining.

Of course, I only know what Sarko has said, not what he has actually done.

Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.

by Starvid on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 04:43:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Look at what he is doing to illegals...

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères
by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 08:16:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, to put it mathematically, Sarkozy=(Berlusconi + G.W.Bush)/2. With a pinch of Dick Cheney thrown in.

Gaullist? de Gaulle would never, in a million years, have endorsed supply-side economics. That is something Sarkozy both said AND did.

You LIKE the foreign policy? Hell, here, only Serge Dassault does. Even people on the right are embarrassed.

Well, got a train to catch so I should stop here.

Earth provides enough to satisfy every man's need, but not every man's greed. Gandhi

by Cyrille (cyrillev domain yahoo.fr) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 11:56:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I think the main difference between me and the other centrists at the ET is that they have come to the center from the left, while I have come to the center from the right. So while we have pretty much the same opinions about stuff, our worldview and basic reactions to things are fundamentally different (yeah I know it sounds fuzzy). For lack of a better word, think of it a little as the culture wars in the US. After all, my view of when everything began heading south is May '68.

Yesterday an opinion piece about Caroline Kennedy's endorsment of Obama captured a bit of what I'm feeling.

[Ted] Kennedy went on to talk about the 1960s. But he didn't talk much about the late '60s, when Bill and Hillary came to political activism. He talked about the early '60s, and the idealism of the generation that had seen World War II, the idealism of the generation that marched in jackets and ties, the idealism of a generation whose activism was relatively unmarked by drug use and self-indulgence.

[...]

The audience at American University roared. It was mostly young people, and to them, the Clintons are as old as the Trumans were in 1960. And in the students' rapture for Kennedy's message, you began to see the folding over of generations, the service generation of John and Robert Kennedy united with the service generation of the One Campaign. The grandparents and children united against the parents.

[...]

The respect for institutions that was prevalent during the early '60s is prevalent with the young again today. The earnest industriousness that was common then is back today. The awareness that we are not self-made individualists, free to be you and me, but emerge as parts of networks, webs and communities; that awareness is back again today.

Sept. 11 really did leave a residue - an unconsummated desire for sacrifice and service.



Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
by Starvid on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 06:31:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That crap you're quoting is from major fake-centrist neocon David Brooks.

And it doesn't mean a thing, it's spin, like most of his writing. There was no earnestly industrious jacket-and-tie respect-for-institutions generation marching against war in the early '60s. Yes, there were civil rights and anti-war protestors of the generation that had known WWII, but one, they were hand-in-hand with young people born just after the war, and two, they were already being smeared and demonised as hairy pot-smoking communist beatniks by the David Brookses of the time. OK, as the '60s went on, hair got longer and more pot was smoked, but those older protestors were in that movement too.

What this is is a now-common ploy with reactionaries: bash the baby-boom generation. Sarkozy's advisors make him do it, and I'm not at all surprised to see Brooks at it.

The meaning of this spin: let's put the clock back. Movement conservatism has done away with the New Deal, now let's revise the history of the nineteen-sixties.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Jan 31st, 2008 at 07:41:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]

French Reflex

Anytime a business scandal erupts, politicians can't help but stick their noses in it. Think Enron, WorldCom and its regulatory offspring, Sarbanes-Oxley. This temptation is double dosed for French mandarins predisposed by long tradition to meddle in private affairs.

(...)

New details emerging about Mr. Kerviel's ability to run around SocGen's internal controls suggest the bank's senior managers deserve a lot of the blame for the mess. But to their credit, they moved to fix the immediate problem on their own without Mr. Sarkozy's assistance. And successfully. The French financial system was never in real danger. SocGen stayed on its feet. No one mooted a rescue à la the $21 billion bailout of Crédit Lyonnais a decade ago. The country's banking regulators were kept in the loop. So, as far as the larger French state should be concerned, SocGen's problems are mainly the responsibility of its management and shareholders. (Its customers aren't affected.)

Earlier this month, before SocGen erupted, Mr. Sarkozy said his goal was "defending and promoting the nation's primordial economic interests." But the state's intrusion in the SocGen and other cases involving big companies in play on the takeover market merely privileges Mr. Sarkozy's friends in the business establishment over shareholders and consumers who stands to benefit from open competition.

The banking industry as a whole would be wise to wake up to the rising political threat and improve internal controls and information-sharing on its own. "No regulation in the world could have foreseen what happened last week in France," points out the EU's internal markets chief, Charlie McCreevy, who writes nearby. In other words, the banks can best fix themselves.

(...)

SocGen is paying a high price for its follies -- as it should. A €5 billion capital injection will dilute its shares. Several senior managers have already lost their jobs, and the top brass may soon follow. That's the way the market is supposed to work.

They do have a point here: if you let the markets rule, you have to let markets solve these problems the way they are supposed to - and as the WSJ points, the only people hurt in that case are those that are supposed to in such circumstances.

Also, their criticism about insiders taking advantage of politicians is quite right. So their suggestion that we have the worst of both worlds is quite on target.

:: ::

Of course, the fact that cosiness between politicians and big business is an almost inevitable feature of financial capitalism (given the stakes, and the easy access and voice given to those with lots of money), and that proper regulation somehow never happens in such a context, is conveniently forgotten by the WSJ.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 09:49:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Not only forgotten, they cite McCreepy as 'proof' that 'no one could have foreseen'.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.
by DoDo on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 04:31:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]
(Its customers aren't affected.)

Not directly, not yet...  Who are they kidding?


Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.

by metavision on Fri Feb 1st, 2008 at 05:17:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Critical of neofeudalism.....

what better direct hit than  the US growing at 0.6% annualized rate and at nearly recession..

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/business/reuters-gdp.html?_r=1&hp&oref=slogin

 adn Europe and china living happily (even waiting for the oil prices to stabilize).... at more than 2%... (with Spain above  3% with those socialists bastards?)

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 09:21:29 AM EST
That's just cyclical.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 09:22:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]
can you imagine the crap over our heads if this would be the other way around? Geee... cyclical

The supposed "US sneezes ,the rest of the world gets a world" the bs we are used to....

Well.. yes if the US real economy gets a cold, we will be affected..but if the neofeudals die of pneuominia.. I doubt we wold even get a cold.

A pleasure.

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 11:15:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That Bouton guy is one of the best paid persons in France and he didn't know shit about what was going on in his bank.

Well, if we measure responsibility by income, Bouton isn't among the top ten wages  in the Société Générale...

Oh, and the "power to the entrepreneur" bit is tiresome when most large companies, i.e. those with power, are very old (how many less-than-20-years-old companies in the CAC40 ?) and Sarkozy himself has as best friends sons of people who created media empires.

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères

by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Wed Jan 30th, 2008 at 09:47:06 AM EST


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