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Personal Stories Off The Beaten Path

by metavision Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 06:22:11 AM EST

I want to thank poemless for the words that seem to describe the juxtapositions of a rare Friday, (25-IV-08) spent in a different planet.  

Odds Never End:  15:00 to 15:50

This afternoon I had an appointment with an endocrine person, after having given up on them for years.  Given the Madrid region´s health system, I had to go to town to see one and it became an exploration and an adventure.


Let me start with the odyssey of the bus trip.  I got on this rickety, rattly bus, inventory #292, from a company probably as old as I am (1), which is owned by a much larger and just as old bus company (2), which has a large, monopoly-service contract to the west of Madrid.  I use it constantly and I´m aware of bus drivers´ surly behavior, which I attribute to their working conditions.  This driver was near retirement age, wore thick glasses and was curt enough to be a quiet ´newyorker´.  I wouldn´t want to be in traffic all day, so that´s ´fine´.

We are about 12 km. from the center of town and with 15:00 Friday traffic, the ride took 50 minutes of stop-and-go-nowhere on the highway:  ´Everybody-and-their-engendrances´ acts entitled to be molded into a car by themselves, creating a traffic nightmare and illegally talking on their cell phone to complain about it to another human being, who could easily be doing exactly the same thing in another traffic jam somewhere.  That´s NOT fine.  

It´s also not fine, that from somewhere within me came the irresistible urge to scream:  "Saca el culo del coche y sácate el cerebro del culo!".  Translated to English that would be "GYAOOTC and GYBOOYA".  Readers, please add the equivalent in other languages.

Someday, when I grow up, I want to think ´... ooh, look at that happy family, all three generations of them, in that cute, little electric car... !´  (Damm; my antique cell phone didn´t have enough balance, nor battery, left to rant to anybody about it.)

I can tell already, I´m going to extend myself and I´ll have to break this diary into hourly tragicomedies.

I looked out the window, concentrated on studying the sky, the trees, the new greenness, .... the high walls and fences everywhere, the construction cranes above the buildings and back again to the signs of nature in spring, where I could find them.  I was glad I had not eaten lunch before that magic ride.

This dear driver had the radio blaring regional music above and beyond all the bus parts banging against each other.  That´s fine because regional folk music makes me want to sing and dance, although the decibel levels were enough to cause permanent hearing damage.  The part that drives me nuts is the whiplash driving.  You´d think that somebody in their sixties, in charge of a bus, had enough experience to smooth out the braking and accelerating to typical traffic conditions, without forcing people to hold on for dear life with both hands....  Not this one.  More often than not, bus, train and subway drivers I have to ride with, are from the same rodeo school of ´transportation management´:  

´Push all limits until something serious happens!´

When something happens, of course, the local and regional, rightwing administration of Madrid and their sheep will baaa-baaa-blame the socialist government, one way or another, through their friendly media.  

(1)  Compañia Llorente
(2)  Grupo Alsa

O.N.E. 16:00 to 17:10

Walked down and around Princesa Street to find a place to eat, but those that looked decent had dishes for 21€ and I kept walking.  After asking a lady who was walking her dog, I stopped near the clinic, at an unknown, cheap cafeteria.  Maybe, I just ´case´ the places unconsciously, but I picked the best people-watching spot and it was at the end of the bar.  I found a paper to read, I got comfortable and I run into a very nice, very sociable, thirty-something waitress to help me.

I had garlic potatoes and meatballs with a glass of wine, before my coffee and it was pretty good.  Garlic and wine.... that should wake up the doc, I told the waitress.  The place wasn´t that busy and the waitress and I commented and nodded as I ate, then,  suddenly, she decided to tell me she was leaving the job after four years because she has had it with a nasty, xenophobic supervisor.  She is affable, articulate, nice looking, does her job with care, but ... she´s South American!  I told her how it shames us all that there are still so many cases of racism and that I´m glad she won´t put up with it because that´s the only thing that will help stop it.  Personally I´m really tired of making my life more difficult for speaking up when I hear it, but shutting up is no
option, either.

At that point, a Joaquin Sabina song was playing and it goes "...with your chin very high, your tongue very long and..." so I gave her a thumbs up and she laughed.  She knows she will find something equal or better, because it seems no locals even consider food service jobs:  ´Market-forces´ have lowered the pay rate to be acceptable to ´immigrant-only´ levels!  

O.N.E. 17:20 to 17:40  I really wish this were very odd.

The clinic is a good, old, 5-story building with marble floors, brass railing staircases, etc., that had obviously been remodeled from residences.  Knowing that the regional administration wants to close it down, my heart sank because I could almost feel the presence of some salivating developer, waiting in the wings, marauding in public offices, to take it down and build another millionaire´s atrocity, in one of the best parts of town.

I sat in the waiting room and saw a flyer about the ongoing, health workers´ action, three times a day for 15 minutes, but I thought it was over because it had no date, so I put it down again.

A young woman in white called me in to the sitting, male, thirty-little endocrinologist and then she sat in silence at a desk next to his, so I thought she was an intern. After the introduction, we began the same-o, new patient questionnaire, including the back and forth about smoking and no, no, I have no-known-allergies!  It seems allergies are so common now that he didn´t believe it.  And, yes, I had an "80% thyroidectomy in 1976 in the states".  He frowned at that.  I told him that´s what the surgeon´s document said. Was I supposed to weigh an measure it?

He looked at the comparative test results I had brought, showing hypothyroidism, he repeated what they said and I started to feel that ...´The patient is crazy until the contrary is scientifically proven´ attitude.  Maybe I act too comfortable with doctors;  not submissive enough?  I don´t know, but before I realize it I start feeling like they are parroting irrelevant stuff and not listening/answering me at all.  I tell myself that kind of treatment was last century, but it´s alive and well, right where I am.  I consciously put aside the gender factor may have anything to do with it, because it is truly maddening, but I had not heard it all, yet.

When he was ´done´, I asked the questions I had about things that may be related, but the doc denied the thyroid had any effect on practically anything else in my body....  Temperature changes and control?  ´No´.  Low energy, low mood, ....?  ´No.´  Any effect on cholesterol levels?  ´No.´  Female hormones, ...hair, nails.... anything? ´No.  You have to go to a gyno for that´.  He insisted however that I take a medium dose of a synthetic thyroid pill!!!  Like.... OK, if it doesn´t affect any of my complaints.... why is there a thyroid gland at all and what´s the pill for, then???  Never mind.

This boy used the last, old, ancient, Jurassic, nuts, insane, unscienfific, irrational........ phrase that women have had to put up with since the beginning of time!!!!!  That idiotic, ignorant, pompous, undeveloped being, uttered the words...:  "It may be your nerves."  My jaw dropped and I decided to just be quiet, looking at him and take no action!  I am so ___ sick of such ´mentalities´, I didn´t even ask him "Exactly, what nerves are those?" because I would have to ask him how many men did it take to ´learn him that´, how many men has he told that absolute crap and take it from there!  (Pardon me, I have to stop writing now to go punch a pillow.)

If that wasn´t enough, he became suddenly sincere with me by telling me that ´for an endocrinologist, the most boooring thiiiiiiing in the world is to treat a hypothyroidism case´!!!  

Bored!  The kid is bored!!!  Well, excuuuuse me!  I have always been told that low-thyroid people tend to be overweight, that I was skinny because my thyroid gland overproduced and yet the tests prove that I am now low on thyroid and I am obviously underweight.  That didn´t cross his pretty, little mind and I was not about to question him to get another shoulder shrug.  Maybe medical knowledge has ´advanced´ (flip flopped) and I would really appreciate hearing it!  Forget that.  He never checked my eyes, my hands, or anything else that other endos have done first thing, so I couldn´t trust it anyway.  As much as I prepare my questions before a visit, most doctors leave me with more questions than when I arrive....

He finally decided to get up!, come around the desk to ´feel´ my thyroid and surprise, surprise....!:  He, brilliantly deduced and said "I don´t find any gland on the right side and there is something on the left, but I don´t know how much".  (Proof of my lefty tendencies.)  That´s it!!!!  He must deduce that I was ´lying to him´, that the gland disappeared right before his very eyes and should go right to the police to file a thryroidtheftomy in his absence of brain!

<It´s a good thing the service is free....  Free?????  What do you mean FREE?  We have all contributed to his ´degree´ and we all pay his salary!>

I swear!  If I didn´t know there are so many people suffering in this world and much more serious problems, I could slap this know-it-all-lived-nothing until he knew how silly he really is.  Do progressive doctors really exist outside electronic visuals?  Does ET have any progressive MD´s?  Or, can we ´order´ some, please?  Maybe I should just stick to Fran, melo and others already here, who integrate study along with experience to provide some human sense.

I walked down the 3 flights of stairs slowly, enjoying the old materials and the workmanship, trying to forget that I just heard a bunch of ´doc-trine´.  Like the good ´patient´ I am, I took the paper number from the red gadget on the wall and waited my turn to get dates for more expensive tests, from expensive facilities, that may be moved elsewhere by then, to give more blood, to use more public funds, to perpetuate this squirrel cage wheel that I bring to a full stop every few years.  I get to the thyroidectable point where I can´t take any more wasteful services from self-entitled morons that guard their knowledge from the patient like an antiquity, and nobody should.  

Got the test dates very quickly because some guy was coming around reminding the staff about ´the demonstration´.  That got me excited...

O.N.E. 17:45 to 18:05

Instant socialist demonstration, just waiting for me.  

This may be the real reason L*ife set me up here today, because the doc certainly wasn´t worth the trip.  The health workers´ action is against the strong push for privatization of health care, which is reaching a peak in Madrid.  I joined the white coats at the front door and in no time I was holding a broomstick attached to one end of a cut up bed sheet  saying "Public Health".  Someone brought out the most deafening, plastic whistles and we waved at the dumbfounded drivers going by.  One guy traded me the flyers for the broomstick and I started giving them out to every passerby, asking very nicely "Would you like to know about it?"  

A couple of people actually took me up on it and I was surprised I could give short, coherent answers on the spot, for which I thank all the ETers that have trained me so well on the ´terra of privatization´.  

About 90% of participants were women in a total of 25-30 people, including 2 patients (no white coat) and if there were more than one or two doctors, I´d eat my hat.  That part was disappointing, but the staff were happy while doing it and it made my day.

A young woman nobody knew was taking photos from across the street, but nobody cared, or bothered to speculate. Towards the end, the staff got brave and we walked back and forth on the painted crosswalk about five times, to stop traffic.  Afterwards, I just applauded them.

O.N.E. 18:10 to 19:20

I went back to the place for an iced decaf after such hard, street work in the sun....  The same waitress asked me what the demonstration was really about and I explained how it becomes private, it costs us more and serves us less.  Again, I really feel I couldn´t be so confident if I hadn´t heard it so well and so much in ET!

It was a perfect evening to walk and sense the city crowds again, so I watched people, waved at little kids and petted dogs before heading back, because the window shopping really wasn´t worth it.  There is very, very little ´in the market´ that attracts me anymore and 99% of clothes shops actually repel me.

The ride back was shorter, although I was ` lucky'  enough to get the same bus with the same driver!, so when I finally got off it, it felt like I had been in a pressurized cabin for a week.

O.N.E. 19:20 to sleep time

Got a load of milk and stuff, stopped by the socialist party storefront and talked to people a while before I ´climbed up the mountain´ again with the load of food, because going to the bus stop would have been sort of a half-way detour.

I got home just in time for the evening news and heard some more ´odd´ things:  

A small plane with 3 people crashed in rural Ciudad Real province causing the death of a Moroccan and a Spaniard.  It was planning to land on a private air field, on a ranch owned by banker Emilito Botín of Banco Santander and it just happened to be carrying 270 kg of hashish.  It´s anybody´s guess.

(Hot off the presses!  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emilio_Botin )

I could not look at another video of public-contracted/private-security guards´ violence in the subway, but I admit that thanks to new cell phones, we can find out and ´force´ some action.

Hey, the head of the Spanish communist party is 93-years young and he´s still smoking and making lots of sense!  I bet he doesn´t listen to doctors much.  (;

There was another contradictory story about sunflower oil with a health department warning to "stop using it"!  Apparently there has been a/some supermarket chain selling ´to-be-disclosed-later´ brands, imported from Ukraine that contain ´some´ amount of ´mineral oils´. ¿Petroleum?  Can they use it for their cars?  It ended with a typical disclaimer implying a guarantee that there is ´no health risk´.  

Sorry, I can´t deconstruct more nonsense from beginning to end and all around again, but please add your own.

Display:
LOLOLOLOL!!!! you made me laugh and I also wanted to scream with you. I know these situations at the doctor's office - I hate them and it's one reason I am learning so much about staying health, to avoid that crap.
by Fran on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 06:38:18 AM EST
It seems to be imprinted into doctors in medical schools everywhere.  You'd think that 30-year olds would have been taught that the patient has some rights, some dignity, some brain...

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.
by metavision on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 11:41:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I have a friend who used to be a paediatric nurse.

It used to drive her insane that whenever she took her own child into the clinic where she worked, the doctors were so used to treating parents with contempt that they wouldn't even listen to her.

The following day, she'd be back in uniform and suddenly her observations became worthwhile again.

by Sassafras on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 01:56:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]
In the U.S., and probably in Europe, I was told some time ago that students got preference in medical school admissions if they exhibited strong tendencies to be authoritarian and expect god-like devotion from others.

That's supposed to have changed in recent years, but I wouldn't count on it. Sounds as if the folks in Madrid never got that memo.

I've been at some pains to educated myself on health and to stay as well as possible, because there's no way you can count on what passes for a medical system here.

by Mnemosyne on Sun May 4th, 2008 at 01:03:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
nice storytelling...

find a naturopath, maybe, or get massages, great for 'the nerves'!

did he want you to go to a neurologist, or just go pick up some 'happy pills' from the psychiatrist?

for all the amazing good doctors can do sometimes, other times they just casually contribute to the problems, clumsily trying to 'fix' them.

your sense of humour is definitely healthy, for sure.

'The history of public debt is full of irony. It rarely follows our ideas of order and justice.' Thomas Piketty

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 09:48:55 AM EST
Oh yes!  Once you start down this path, you 'get to'  visit every specialty in the book, except maybe the podiatrist, all in the wrong order, so that test results never coincide with the appropriate doctor and the result, should I pursue it to its end, will be 'Well, we don't know, but it's not this'.

Could I ever use a massage!  I'll have to make a lot of calls to get a trustworthy naturopath, but there must be some here.  Is there a professional association of some kind?

Meanwhile they´ve ordered neck scans and brain (?) scans, so I will glow before long.

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.

by metavision on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 11:59:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
yeah, they're in cahoots, by the time you've schlepped yourself around all the busses, waiting rooms, hospitals etc, if you weren't enervated and immune-challenged before, you will sure be good for business by then.

europe has pretty strict laws for naturopaths, so i would think you'd find one in spain quite easily, with yellow pages.

massage therapy, ask around, perhaps you have a girlfriend who gets them, or check the health food store.

they have them in spain, no?

treat yourself really well, it'll help to balance out the prodding and poking.

'The history of public debt is full of irony. It rarely follows our ideas of order and justice.' Thomas Piketty

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 08:15:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If you find a better doctor, please tell me. I'm in the market for an endocrinologist.

I think that their behaviour must be specific to a belief that in no circumstances can a patient know more about their own health than we. Even female doctors seem to be up to the same tricks as the male ones: putting your condition down to 'something else unspecified, but definitely a woman thing'. I think I mentioned that my doctor denied that a certain drug existed at all, then after about 20 minutes of discussion, came round to admitting it existed, but she wasn't willing to prescribe it.

Sometimes I wish that just for a day we could have a kind of health care where the careers of doctors like these die a quick and violent death at the hands of their patients. But you just know that your doctor is going to be a misery-maker to countless people for the next thirty years. Bastard.

Member of the Anti-Fabulousness League since 1987.

by Ephemera on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 10:57:27 AM EST
You are right that it´s not just male doctors, but a programming that overrules common sense.  I have heard it so many times, I could pull my hair out.  

In the states, Armour made a ´natural´ thyroid from sheep that worked well for me, but doctors refuse to prescribe it because it´s not from a pharma lab.  I don´t know if I´d trust Armour (meat packing) at this point, but the synthetic has side effects that doctors deny on principle.  

Maybe before my next appointment, the doc should be interviewed by ET.

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.

by metavision on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 12:27:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I think that their behaviour must be specific to a belief that in no circumstances can a patient know more about their own health than we.  

I once came down with Lyme disease.  Although I never saw the deer tick--they are TINY--I had been in the woods, I had all the symptoms, a classic case, right down to the steadily growing bull's-eye rash.  

But, because I suggested they check for that--having the symptoms and all--that was the one thing the hospital did NOT test for.  (They did not tell me though.)  A dozen tests, and vials of blood, but the labs reported back negative:  They had no idea what I had.  

Within a month I was having paralysis (Lyme disease is a SERIOUS, terminal degenerative illness (but slow) caused by a spirochete--same category as syphilis, and a new doctor noticed that the original tests had not included a test for Lyme.  Another week of delay--more paralysis!--before I could pick up my prescription of doxicycline which cleared it up in 3 days (though, yes, I did the full series).  

Some doctors do not care if you live or die.  I find it scary.  

The Fates are kind.

by Gaianne on Sun May 4th, 2008 at 10:43:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I had a similar experience (though without the potential serious consequences) when I returned from California to Germany with a serious case of poison ivy. For anybody who has lived in the US, this is easy to self-diagnose, but the German doctors had never seen a case of this before, and, ignoring my diagnosis, decided it was an allergy to something in my apartment. Fortunately, the treatment was probably the same, and I ignored their suggestion of a hospital visit for tests to find out exactly what I was allergic to.
by gk (gk (gk quattro due due sette @gmail.com)) on Mon May 5th, 2008 at 05:12:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"Even female doctors"????????
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 05:49:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Uhm, I tried to read this and had a little difficulty trying to understand it.  I gather from the comments that it's about going to the doctor.  I have this thing where I faint very easily and ever since the last time I tried to make it through an episode of House (was unsuccessful) I've made a little rule for myself to avoid any discussion of doctors' visits unless absolutely necessary, so I'm not going to read this diary.  In fact, I'm starting to feel a bit off just writing this.

But I thought I should comment seeing as you stole my words.  That's ok.  I didn't actually pay anything for them myself.  Well, 'cept for the blood, sweat and tears...

;p

"Pretending that you already know the answer when you don't is not actually very helpful." ~Migeru.

by poemless on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 02:07:35 PM EST
Well, in my usual British way, just to be fair, I have to say my experience of doctors and specialists in France has been very good (and it wasn't so bad in the UK, apart from the delays). I've visited 3 GPs here, and older Greek guy in Paris, good sense of humour, spoke not bad English (though I tried to do my bit in French) and sympa.

Here in Nice, I went to a young guy, very relaxed, t-shirt and jeans, but attentive and understanding and seemed quite competent.

When we changed address, I signed up with a female doctor  someone recommended. She seems excellent, the only problem is that she gives you so much time and discusses everything in such detail, including your preferred areas of France, that you find yourself waiting an hour after your appointment time to see her.

I have  seen a variety of specialists for check-ups: a chuckling bon-viveur type who did a sound scan on my abdomen; a sympa type who seemed very professional too about my lower interior; a cardiologist who seemed thorough and was  appropriately sarcastic about my need to lose some weight: a dynamic female skin specialist who chatted generally and tried to put me in touch with a colleague who is also interested  in local  history.

Maybe it's that I'm a male and/or I'm just not demanding enough :-)

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice.

by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 04:24:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
was this a reply to me?

"Pretending that you already know the answer when you don't is not actually very helpful." ~Migeru.
by poemless on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 04:27:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]
No, to the diary - my careless clicking on what to reply to.

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice.
by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 05:12:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ouch!

I not only gave you credit, but I actually took the words off the title, in all due respect.  (:

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.

by metavision on Sat May 3rd, 2008 at 06:42:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Me gusta su escrito!!

Rants are good, and especially when they're larded hypnotically with peeks and flashes how living in Madrid looks like. The description of your bus ride and unfortunate chauffeur had me exploding with laughter.

Please keep us posted...

by Nomad on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 04:29:54 PM EST
I´m glad you laughed, Nomad and reminds me that I should laugh while I am living it and not just when I am writing it.  Give me patience!  (;

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.
by metavision on Sat May 3rd, 2008 at 07:50:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
it is a well-known epdiemy among the so-called "specialist" sector of medicine... they do nto knw a jot but tehy are "specialists" so they do nto listen or care as much as a general doctor...

Titulitis is really rampant in the specialist sector.. my grandma almost killed one of them two years ago...because you know.. one can not know why one gets blind after an eye operation.. gee beee.

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 04:49:55 PM EST
I meant .. the specialist sector (consulta de especialista) in Spain... I do not kno other countries.. but in Spain is a well-known plague. That's whye verybody goes either to your local doctor (mcuh mroe nicer) or directly to the hospital where they treat everybody (generally) seriously. Guess why hospitals are saturated?

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 04:51:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]


That's whye verybody goes either to your local doctor (mcuh mroe nicer) or directly to the hospital where they treat everybody (generally) seriously.

And you're a scientist - "everybody" ? - but at least you became a bit more careful - so we get "everybody (generally)".

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice.

by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 05:20:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I meant "everybody" as an exageration of my point. On both cases. So you can put the generally on both counts...but .. I hoped that people understood it was not literal stuff.

I really do not understand your point. Are you asking if I am scientists? What this has to do with my comment about Spain?

I am sorry, but I do not get it.

A pleasure


I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sat May 3rd, 2008 at 05:27:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Generally - scientists tend to avoid sweeping generalizations based on anecdotal evidence :-)

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice.
by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Sat May 3rd, 2008 at 06:54:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
J ej ejje

and get rid of the metaphors??? No way... I love exaggerations.. as long as everybody understands it is one... that's why I contradict generalizations only when most people around are going to beleive it..literally.. like all women are such and such or all men are such and such... or other nonsense...

Saying that all republcian in the US are evil is an exaggeration I am willing to make..and beign a scientists ain't gonna stop me :)

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sat May 3rd, 2008 at 07:28:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Saying that all republcian in the US are evil is an exaggeration I am willing to make..and beign a scientists ain't gonna stop me :)

All manicheanism is evil :-)

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice.

by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Sat May 3rd, 2008 at 08:13:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
oh Geee.. No no no je jej eje
 manicehanism is great:). just the uses are wrong... I bet some democrats feel so beaten that they are eager to counteract in kind...

But indeed this is a nice and interestign question...should the left-wing do whatever it takes to win (I mean narratively speaking.. of course not illegal stuff)? It is a good question... and it is true that I came to think that with  some ideas, you  have to do anything it takes to defeat those ideas. I think it is fine to be a "maniqueo" with a bunch of ideas..and certainly neocon-neolib or fascism or racism are among them...

But I understand that some people might not agree...

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sat May 3rd, 2008 at 02:32:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

and it is true that I came to think that with  some ideas, you  have to do anything it takes to defeat those ideas.

Obviously you haven't really given this serious thought - for example you might "defeat" certain ideas by imprisoning those who hold them, and torturing them till they publicly repudiate those ideas.

Beware of becoming the "solution" you abhor.

Maybe it's because I'm a Londoner - that I moved to Nice.

by Ted Welch (tedwelch-at-mac-dot-com) on Sun May 4th, 2008 at 06:15:23 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Viva tu Abuela!  I want to meet her because mine had that ´quality´ also and I miss her.

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.
by metavision on Sat May 3rd, 2008 at 07:38:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]
One of the great things about being TG is that my doctor freely confesses to knowing nothing about my condition and so will cheerfully agree to pretty much anything.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Fri May 2nd, 2008 at 05:51:28 PM EST
Helen, you would be my perfect spokesperson for doctor visits!  I bet you'd calmly get real answers before leaving.  

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.
by metavision on Sat May 3rd, 2008 at 06:39:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Although my lack of spanish might be problematic.

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Sat May 3rd, 2008 at 10:31:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yesterday, at the traditional spring gathering of one branch of my family, there were two doctors.

I first asked them to tell the side effects of hypothyroidism, if there are any. They proceeded to list a lot, including ones you mention.

Then I told about your experiences with doctors, the "nerves" thing. Then they switched 180 degrees, and defended doctors' reputation: first they thought to dismiss it as silly readers' letters (but I told no, it's first-person from people I know). Then they exclaimed that patients often imagine things, but this is a complex disease that is very difficult to treat (vs. your doctor's "most boooring thiiing"), needing tests to tell for sure. Then I told about you not having much tests and checks by that doctor...

After that, I continued to press them, to explain that doctor's attitude that the patient shall not enquire and shall not be told what his/her problem is. Again full denial... (Though here it must be said that these two doctor relatives of mine I know to be different.)

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.

by DoDo on Sun May 4th, 2008 at 02:05:40 PM EST
Forgot to say, great prose! You should write more diaries!

There is one thing I feel forced to comment:

Hey, the head of the Spanish communist party is 93-years young and he´s still smoking and making lots of sense!  I bet he doesn´t listen to doctors much.  (;

It's not the logical error itself that is of interest (the error being that with the occurence of most cigarette-associated diseases being one with a statistical probability rather than certainty, anecdotal evidence in no way disproves harmfulness), but that virtually every smoker I know has such a story and feels the need to re-tell it him/herself and everyone who'd listen.

*Lunatic*, n.
One whose delusions are out of fashion.

by DoDo on Sun May 4th, 2008 at 02:11:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Thank you for checking the experience, DoDo.  It´s incredible what a white coat (or a uniform) can do to a person´s behavior, sometimes.  I have two doctors in the immediate family, who contradict eachother constantly and I wouldn't trust with a cotton ball.  (;

So, what specialist do I need for the ´smoker self-defense syndrome´?  (;   No, no, don´t answer that, please!

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.

by metavision on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 05:47:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The patient is crazy until the contrary is scientifically proven´ attitude.  Maybe I act too comfortable with doctors;  not submissive enough?  I don´t know, but before I realize it I start feeling like they are parroting irrelevant stuff and not listening/answering me at all.    

Way too familiar.  

I could not look at another video of public-contracted/private-security guards´ violence in the subway  

This is happening in socialist countries too?  Have you contracted Anglo Disease after all?  

imported from Ukraine that contain ´some´ amount of ´mineral oils

So while we are putting food in our gas tanks you are eating petrol straight from the can . . . ?  

The Fates are kind.

by Gaianne on Sun May 4th, 2008 at 10:26:07 PM EST
Metavision, I know someone in Madrid who is being treated for a thyroid condition, and had good things to say about her endocrinologist. Would you like me to ask her for his name and address?

You're clearly a dangerous pinko commie pragmatist.
by Vagulus on Wed May 7th, 2008 at 06:46:34 AM EST
Goodness, YES, please, certainly!  I´ll go to a private doctor if denmadrid around gmail dot com can have the darn hormone balanced, for once.

And thank you.

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.

by metavision on Thu May 8th, 2008 at 05:56:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]


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