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Thursday Open Thread

by afew Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 12:33:19 PM EST

Just another Thursday?


Display:
Or how unique is it?
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 12:33:54 PM EST
A unique probability in time and space.
by In Wales (inwales aaat eurotrib.com) on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 01:54:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]
with unique divergence in parallel universes.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin
by Crazy Horse on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 03:37:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Decade-old espionage malware found targeting government computers:

Researchers have unearthed a decade-long espionage operation that used the popular TeamViewer remote-access program and proprietary malware to target high-level political and industrial figures in Eastern Europe.


She believed in nothing; only her skepticism kept her from being an atheist. -- Jean-Paul Sartre
by ATinNM on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 01:18:19 PM EST
that's how my ex-boss spied on me in my job at the European Commission.
by stevesim on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 04:53:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ah, good times! :)

Fortum Advances to 10-Month High on Windfall Cut

Fortum Oyj (FUM1V), the biggest utility in Finland, gained to a 10-month high in Helsinki as the government decided to cut the amount it plans to raise from a windfall tax.

The company climbed 3.4 percent to 15.82 euros, the highest level since May 15

[...]

"For Fortum, this means a relief of about 60 million euros annually," Karri Rinta, an analyst at Svenska Handelsbanken AB, said by phone. "This shows that the political risk involving utilities in the Nordic countries is clearly lower than in Southern Europe and perhaps elsewhere in the region."

Fortum generates electricity from nuclear and hydropower.



Peak oil is not an energy crisis. It is a liquid fuel crisis.
by Starvid on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 01:55:41 PM EST
For all german speakers, Theme Energiewende on Illner tonight. Looks as if she's lined up guests to burst Airbag Altmeier's lies (i hope). Please watch, because today's decisions have kept renewables in uncertainty, and under attack. I haven't previewed the show, but know some of the guests' positions. With luck, this show will begin to break the lies.

Muss ich dass auf Deutsch übersetzen?

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 03:41:15 PM EST
Muss ich dass auf Deutsch übersetzen?

No, just repeat slowly and louder. That always works.

by IM on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 04:03:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"With luck, this show will begin to break the lies."

Even Die Tagesschau bashes Altmeier, so don't despair. He has only half a year left.

by Katrin on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 04:17:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
When i stood next to him in Husum, i so wanted to use his gut to test out my right-left-right quickness. Alas...

"half a year"?

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 04:25:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Half a year, because the SPD will not tolerate him in a grand coalition. At least not as environment minister, and I don't know a minister chair that is low enough for him. Perhaps development: after Niebel probably everything would be an improvement. In a black and green coalition Altmeier will certainly lose his job. If the CDU/CSU is kicked out of the government, he is on the dole too. There is only one constellation favourable for him. And we won't take pessimism so far as to think the FDP jumps the 5% again, will we?
by Katrin on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 04:55:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Makes me wonder, predicting the guests' positions, if she wanted to try and set the record straight from her own favorable bias. She's going to have an energy economist call for more transparency, and less lying, about true energy costs. And if the chairman of EWE (5th largest energy concern, and owner of Alpha Ventus offshore park) says what he must, Altmeier is toast. (Not to mention Trittin, who first called Altmeier "Airbag." and the woman who wants to buy Berlin's grid.)

Was that slow and loud enough?

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 04:21:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
To be honest I ignore this type of talk shows. I don't think they really move anything politically. Altmaier could killl himself (politically), but I doubt he is inept enough for that.
by IM on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 04:41:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Agree. I haven't watched one for years.
by Katrin on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 04:49:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Also agreed, but tonight is more about the messages sent to those not so politically evolved. Will tonight's show be a key time that major media deconstructs the prevalent lies?

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin
by Crazy Horse on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 05:06:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
For non-German speakers, this is important as well, because renewables and the EEG (feed-in tariff law) is under serious attack in the home of sustainability, 'Schland (Germany). today's political Mist i don't think will prevail, but if it does, it won't bode well for the rest of Yurp.

At least renewables in 'Schland are so strong, as to make the worst case a compromise. Unless the current propaganda begins to take hold.

What's truly important for ETers to know is that both Trittin and his wife are Katzenjammer lovers, though i didn't see either at Marianne's solo effort (Dandylion, simply awesome, in Berlin two weeks ago.)



"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 04:35:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]
As hoped for, it was the two women who carried the show, like normal NDN culture. i won't go into the details, but i will say, you couldn't have that show, that debate, in Amurka.

That the counter-culture woman with no money [pierced) wishes to buy the Berlin grid, that she was so intelligent and strong in her presence, and that the economist was able to destroy Airbag's statement by saying it was 0.03% of the year's electricity price, made me believe it's still ok to be human and take a stand.

How it affected the electorate i don't know, but it seems Berlin has a new heroine.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 06:43:19 PM EST
[ Parent ]
and from a media culture analysis, me thought it was awesome that Illner's show had the berlin woman sitting in the audience at first, then gave her a mini-podium to speak, then brought her up to the main table for the rest of the show. And let her fire away.

Deconstruct that.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 06:47:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hadn't seen this before but this is Dandylion (my opinion, one of the best singer songwriters of since decades)

saying OK, i write a pop song if i must.

after the Berlin show we didn't have enough time to meet, nor make plans. so we went to one of the 22,323 bars in Berlin. at half three, in walks the band. you can imagine the warmth, as they joined us in shining.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 08:06:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ok, you lot.

My Number One Son is currently in Prague - the half way point - a day early on his sponsored hitch-hike from Sheffield University to Vilnius (I shudder at the weather forecast there).

Any ideas for what he and his co-hitchers should see/do tomorrow in Prague?  

Oh, and all sponsorships gratefully received, no matter how small!

"The future is already here -- it's just not very evenly distributed" William Gibson

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 06:47:37 PM EST
No advice here will impact what he will find for himself in greater downtown Praha. Me 119% sure he won't need advice...

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin
by Crazy Horse on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 06:51:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hmmm....so long as he doesn't need antibiotics....

"The future is already here -- it's just not very evenly distributed" William Gibson
by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 08:30:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Too late for that, Pops. ;-)

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin
by Crazy Horse on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 09:03:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If he drinks he must go to the U Fleku pub. A unique beer.

Also, he should take the walk up the hill to the castle thourhg the back street, wonderful old buildings all the way. Maybe walk through the tv tower park on the way down.

also, he should ask (or write it down and show) for kvasnicové pivo in every pub. Most bars don't serve it, but its the unfiltered beer and is very tasty. You won't find it much outside Prague, let alone Czech republic.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 03:58:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
HOW HITLER DEFIED...

Like the U.S. Federal Reserve, the Reichsbank was overseen by appointed government officials, but was operated for private gain. What drove the wartime inflation into hyperinflation was speculation by foreign investors, who sold the mark short, betting on its decreasing value. In the manipulative device known as the short sale, speculators borrow something they don't own, sell it, and then "cover" by buying it back at the lower price.

Speculation in the German mark was made possible because the PRIVATELY OWNED Reichsbank (not yet under Nazi control) made massive amounts of currency available for borrowing. This currency, like U.S. currency today, was created with accounting entries on the bank's books. Then the funny-money was lent at compound interest. When the Reichsbank could not keep up with the voracious demand for marks, other private banks were allowed to create marks out of nothing, and to lend them at interest. The result was runaway debt and inflation.

Thus, according to Schacht himself, the German government did not cause the Weimar hyperinflation. On the contrary, the government (under the National Socialists) got hyperinflation under control. The National Socialists put the Reichsbank under strict government regulation, and took prompt corrective measures to eliminate foreign speculation. One of those measures was to eliminate easy access to funny-money loans from private banks. Then Hitler got Germany back on its feet by having the public government issue Treasury Certificates.

Schacht , the Rotchschild agent, disapproved of this government fiat money, and wound up getting fired as head of the Reichsbank when he refused to issue it. Nonetheless, he acknowledged in his later memoirs that allowing the government to issue the money it needed did not produce the price inflation predicted by classical economic theory, which says that currency must be borrowed from private cartels.

What causes hyper-inflation is uncontrolled speculation. When speculation is coupled with debt (owed to private banking cartels) the result is disaster. On the other hand, when a government issues currency in carefully measured ways, it causes supply and demand to increase together, leaving prices unaffected. Hence there is no inflation, no debt, no unemployment, and no need for income taxes.

Naturally this terrifies the bankers, since it eliminates their powers.

there is some ugly stuff i omitted for the sake of good taste, that's tangential. what interests me is the economic, financial and monetary aspects of the story, and most of all, if there's any truth in, or is it debunkable, or just debancable?


'The history of public debt is full of irony. It rarely follows our ideas of order and justice.' Thomas Piketty

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 09:21:39 PM EST
If he follows Ellen Brown closely he is likely to be pretty much on track.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Thu Mar 21st, 2013 at 10:33:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Ellen Brown has a Cyprus article.
by das monde on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 08:57:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Excellent article!

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 12:32:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Unfortunately he only borrows bits and pieces from Brown and then uses them in a rather creative and misleading way. For instance, speculation is often involved in asset inflation, be it stocks or real estate, but not so much in monetary inflation, especially hyperinflation. And the proximate cause of German hyperinflation was the seizure of the Rhur by France, which destroyed the ability of Germany to make anything which their currency could buy, coupled with unsupportable demands for reparations payments in hard currency.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 12:46:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Its a mess.

Just to pick the worst:

On the contrary, the government (under the National Socialists) got hyperinflation under control.

Hyperinflation happened in 1921-3. The nazis came to power in 1933.

Schacht , the Rotchschild agent, disapproved of this government fiat money, and wound up getting fired as head of the Reichsbank when he refused to issue it.

In reality:

Hjalmar Schacht - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

After Hitler took power in January 1933, Schacht won re-appointment as Reichsbank President on 17 March.

In August 1934 Hitler appointed Schacht as Germany's Minister of Economics.

He was a minister until 1943, though in practise fell from power in 1936-7, after which he was involved in coup plans against Hitler.

Oh, and what set off the German hyperinflation was trying to pay the reparations.

So, whatever they are trying to say, it has nothing to do with what happened in Germany in the 1920ies and 1930ies.

Sweden's finest (and perhaps only) collaborative, leftist e-newspaper Synapze.se

by A swedish kind of death on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 04:39:25 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Gaah. Doesn't this have the sticky fingerprints of a (no doubt antisemitic) truther all over it?

Weimar hyperinflation reached its peak in 1923. Hitler came to power ten years later, in a deflationary environment.

The entire Wikipedia article on Hyperinflation in the Weimar Republic is worth reading to get the history clearer.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 04:46:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That is the traditional conspiracy about the Fed - privately owned, Rothschild, translated to the Reichsbank and a dash of Hitler added.

The Reichsbank was privately owned but government-controlled. Prior to 1922 directly, then it was independent. Following the Dawes-plan, the Reichsbank was independent but half or its board appointed by foreign powers. Following the Young-Plan, the board was since 1930 appointed by the german government again.

Schacht did co-create the Rentenmark and thenwas appointed president of the Reichsbank. He did resign in 929 to protest against the Young-Plan. In 1933 Hitler demanded money creation and or credit from the Reichsbank but the president Hans Luther was reluctant. Lurther was then sent as ambassador tot he US and Schacht returned.

Now it gets interesting:

"Then Hitler got Germany back on its feet by having the public government issue Treasury Certificates."

As long as they talk about Mefo-Bills, that is broadly true. Mefo-Bills were issued from a state owned private company but discounted by the Reichsbank. Additionally to that were also considerable budget deficits financed in traditional ways. So the Mefo-Bills were a form of unconventional monetary polica flanked by classic fiscal stimulus.

 "Schacht , the Rotchschild agent, disapproved of this government fiat money, and wound up getting fired as head of the Reichsbank when he refused to issue it."

No, he invented this fiat money. It is true that he wanted to recall the Mefo-Bills in the late thirties and also wanted to reduce the budget deficits. Because this clashed with rearmament, he was fired.

"Nonetheless, he acknowledged in his later memoirs that allowing the government to issue the money it needed did not produce the price inflation predicted by classical economic theory, which says that currency must be borrowed from private cartels."

Who knows what Schacht did write. Schacht is a very unreliable Narrator, reducing everything to greater glory of Schacht. If Schacht just claimed that Mefo-Bills did not cause inflation in he thirties that much seems to be true.
 

by IM on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 05:36:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
As to the claim of Schacht's disapproving of fiat money, google mefo bill.
Then there is the fairy tale in that article that the nazis stimulated the economy by all that construction work. In reality they had opposed all plans to do that, with the result that there were only few programmes. The nazis didn't stop projects already started when they came to power, and still get the credit for the Autobahn (first bit opened in 1932) and the construction of homes. These projects were replaced by armament and fortification asap, though.
by Katrin on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 04:59:12 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The Weimar hyper inflation was caused primarily by reparations Germany had to make to France and the Weimar government's decision to pay those reparations by printing money.

This happened as follows: Germany didn't have the real resources to to pay. They were supposed to pay in either gold or foreign currency (can't remember which). So, Weimar says, no problem, I'll print some reichsmarks, go over to the exchange counter and get the gold or foreign currency I need and pay it to France. This worked once (sort of) but you know, fool me once shame on you, and France (and the markets) weren't stupid; next time Weimar tried this, everyone was on to this and no amount of reichmarks were enough to pay on exchange markets to pay the reparations, and hyperinflation was born while France occupied Germany to get its reparations in-kind.

All of this in the early 1920's, way before the Nazis.

The solution to the hyperinflation crisis also had nothing to do with the Nazis, though I think Schachtcwas involved. A new mark was introduced. This one pegged more or less to gold (reichmark wasn't ever since WW1) and circulation limited, so for awhile Germany had two currencies with a fluctuating exchange between the two.

No doubt savvy currency speculators made money during this time but saying they caused the inflation is like saying mice caused the crumbs on the floor. And no doubt it was harder to short sell the new marks, but only because there were less of them...you don't need to borrow from the central bank to short a currency... You just need to borrow it from someone, anyone.

This stuff you got here sounds like goldbuggism and pro-nazi propaganda...where did you get it?

The Hun is always either at your throat or at your feet. Winston Churchill

by r------ on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 05:03:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Minor nitpick: the new Mark after the hyperinflation, the Rentenmark, was pegged to rents, not gold.
by Katrin on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 05:24:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]
thanks ETers for the info. i should have known...


'The history of public debt is full of irony. It rarely follows our ideas of order and justice.' Thomas Piketty
by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 05:33:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The article cites Henry_Makow, who runs a delicious website "Exposing Feminism and The New World Order", and Ellen Brown as sources. From the article on Brown:
Financial crises always spark interest in marginal critics of the system. One that's attracted interest on the left is Ellen Brown, who's got a book and a website called Web of Debt. She and her kind should be given wide berth.

Good advice
by Katrin on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 05:16:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Tells a lot about the gullibility of the American (or perhaps Californian) left.

The Hun is always either at your throat or at your feet. Winston Churchill
by r------ on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 05:28:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You would be surprised how easily classical conspiracy theories of the american right - the privately owned fed, the social security card that make you owned by banks, obama care obligates everybody to implant chips - will resurface among the german left. At least on facebook.  
by IM on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 06:41:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Hjallmar Schacht and the Nazis were discussed here on ET 3 1/2 years ago.

This

the government (under the National Socialists) got hyperinflation under control.
Is total bullshit. The Hyperinflation was over at the end of 1923. The way this was achieved (by Schacht) was by replacing the Reichsmark with the Rentenmark and simultaneously prohibit the discounting of German government bonds for central bank money.

The mention of Schacht as a "Rotchschild agent" (note the typo) is a dead giveaway too: "the Jewish bankers caused hyperinflation and Hitler fixed it!" is.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper

by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 05:34:14 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Sorry, I'm troll-rating that. Nothing personal.

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper
by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 05:35:00 AM EST
[ Parent ]
by das monde on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 05:52:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
don't we all?

If you look at me, you will think Nordic - tall, blonde, etc

But my blood type is B -ve which is rather rare in Europe, and probably came from some Mongol ancestor who had raped one of my foremothers.

I wonder why people are still so surprised with this mingling of genetic material.

by stevesim on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 06:11:38 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It's because they're obsessed with the concept of race. People are intimately convinced that black people are all related (there is more genetic diversity in black Africa than in the rest of the world combined) and that white people are all related (whereas presumably successive waves of black Africans whitened independently as a genetic adaptation to less sunlight : white Neanderthals, white Cro-Magnons etc)

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 06:40:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Everyone should have the right to ask a question.  
by stevesim on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 06:12:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]
You are getting more severe with the years:

http://www.eurotrib.com/comments/2009/9/1/55028/62542/23#23

by IM on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 06:32:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I already linked to that thread myself.

Also, do you see any reference to Rot[c]hschild causing hyperinflation in that old thread?

guaranteed to evoke a violent reaction from police is to challenge their right to "define the situation." --- David Graeber citing Marc Cooper

by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 06:38:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

While Schacht isn't a Rothschild agent yet, Brown basically writes the same text:

"Schacht revealed that it was the privately-owned Reichsbank, not the German government, that was pumping new currency into the economy. Like the U.S. Federal Reserve, the Reichsbank was overseen by appointed government officials but was operated for private gain. What drove the wartime inflation into hyperinflation was speculation by foreign investors, who would sell the mark short, betting on its decreasing value. In the manipulative device known as the short sale, speculators borrow something they don't own, sell it, then "cover" by buying it back at the lower price. Speculation in the German mark was made possible because the Reichsbank made massive amounts of currency available for borrowing, marks that were created with accounting entries on the bank's books and lent at a profitable interest. When the Reichsbank could not keep up with the voracious demand for marks, other private banks were allowed to create them out of nothing and lend them at interest as well.7"

by IM on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 06:49:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]
"I already linked to that thread myself."

No doubt, that is how I learned about that. The brown theory seems to be a zombie, resurfacing again and again.

by IM on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 06:51:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]
But that thread quotes John Kenneth Galbraith as well.
by das monde on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 07:03:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Ah ok, now I see. The facebook author did use the book or some blog entry of Brown as basis and then added jews, jewry and jewish at the appropriate spots.

That is another quality.

by IM on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 07:02:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
No prob. A TR is a small price for the intelligent feedback in a friendly e-nvironment.
I learned a lot. Thanks folks!

'The history of public debt is full of irony. It rarely follows our ideas of order and justice.' Thomas Piketty
by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 08:22:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Celle Hole - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Celle Hole (German: Celler Loch) is a breach in the outer wall of the prison of Celle, Germany. First used on July 25, 1978, the name was part of a campaign by one of the West German secret services (Landesbehörde für Verfassungsschutz) and the GSG 9 in an attempt to lay blame on the Red Army Faction, West Germany's most active and prominent left-wing terrorist group. However, the incident was revealed in 1986 to be a plot by the government, much to the embarrassment of the government. The Verfassungsschutz used the name 'Operation Fire Magic' (German: Aktion Feuerzauber).

More recently there appeared an affidavit (German/pdf) by German historian Andreas Kramer claiming that his father was involved in several false flag terror attacks in the 80s as operational leader of the Stay-Behind Network in Germany.

by generic on Fri Mar 22nd, 2013 at 08:05:03 AM EST


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