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Just deserts for Republican House Members elect

by ARGeezer Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 02:45:44 AM EST

All of the newly elected Republican Members of the House of Representatives who endorsed the meretricious Texas lawsuit to throw out the results of four states who voted for Biden should be charged with sedition and barred taking their seats and from again running for Congress. This nonsense has to stop and such action would be a strong signal that it will not be tolerated.

To that end Bill Pascrell, Jr., Democrat from New Jersey tweeted the  following and wrote a letter to House leadership recommending such action:

Section 3 of the 14th Amendment was written after the Civil War to bar from government any traitors who would seek to destroy the Union.

Today I'm calling on House leaders to refuse to seat any Members trying to overturn the election and make donald trump an unelected dictator.

It is clearly within the power of the House to refuse to seat members for cause. Sedition should qualify as a cause. Perhaps the House could conduct an investigation to  determine if sedition has occurred. If so it could at least attempt to bar them from running again. But just having to run again for their seats would be a quite considerable punishment. Pelosi strongly condemned their action. Further pressure from House Members is in order.


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Questions concerning behavior of House Members falls under the jurisdiction of the House Ethics Committees, whose membership is evenly split between parties. But questions on seating newly elected members is part of the first day proceedings. During those proceedings the Speaker is first elected and then sworn in. Then comes the swearing in of the newly elected members. "If the swearing-in of a Member is challenged, the Speaker, pursuant to House precedents, will ask the Member-elect to remain seated while the others are sworn in. The House then determines the disposition of the challenge."

How could a member elect swear to uphold and defend the Constitution of the United States when they had just acted to violate parts of that Constitution? They don't get to pick and choose which articles to uphold and defend.

But I dream.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."

by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 03:41:36 AM EST
The House, at this time, could also recommend refer charges of sedition to the Department of Justice after the Presidential Inauguration on Jan 20.
 

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 03:45:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
by Cat on Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 09:28:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes, sedition has been defined in overly broad ways that impinge the 1st Amendment and the list of those censured and reprimended often reflect political power and favor.


"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 10:37:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]
government for a redress of grievances,
or the right (to pay) to file a law suit

RIGHTS OF ASSEMBLY AND PETITION,
Right of the United States to Sue,
Access to Courts , and
The First Amendment Right to a Remedy, commentary.

Why the US is the most ignorant, litigious nation on planet.

by Cat on Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 11:32:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
A lawsuit is neither sedition nor treason.
by Cat on Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 11:49:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]
A lawsuit, no matter how vexatious or frivolous, is neither sedition nor treason. FIFY.

Index of Frank's Diaries
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 11:56:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]


Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.
by Cat on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 03:09:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]
But encouraging militias to intimidate and threaten elected officials with a view to subverting the result of an election is.

The sedition isn't in the lawsuits, but in the organisation of a range of activities intended to subvert the constitutional stability of the electoral process - not least in the pre-planned strategy of attempting to disqualify mail-in ballots on spurious grounds during a pandemic.

The problem isn't that the GOP are suing, but that the Dems aren't. They have a much stronger case - because those premeditated actions, including armed intimidation, were planned, encouraged, and executed in an attempt to subvert the election.

The fact that the subversion didn't succeed is incidental, because success is irrelevant to conspiracy. The conspiracy that planned the actions is the problem, and it would be unhealthy to allow it to continue without legal consequences.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 01:17:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I look forward to Trump being indicted on conspiracy charges on foot of his frequent inflammatory twitter rants and nefarious activities behind the scenes. Hopefully someone, somewhere, is compiling a book of evidence. Can't see it happening though. Of course he can always pardon himself...

Index of Frank's Diaries
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 01:00:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Good luck going after Trump when he has cut and run to Moscow
by asdf on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 06:17:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
If ONLY Trump would decamp to Moscow permanently. But even that would not dissuade the majority of his devoted followers, but it would dissuade some at least and it would undercut his credibility. More satisfying would be for him to end like his avatar Mussolini.
 

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 09:59:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Prosecutors Investigating the Trump Organization Zero In on Trump CFO Allen Weisselberg

Quid pro quo - path bought by US Treasury [taxpayers money ☹] - places for exile: Jerusalem - Abu Dhabi - Baku Azerbaijan and the Pacific Isle of Tovu ... oh wait, scrap Baku

by Oui on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 07:05:42 PM EST
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Israel and Abu Dhabi will probably hand him over if offered a large enough bribe (also known as "military aid").
by gk (gk (gk quattro due due sette @gmail.com)) on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 07:08:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I believe the Abu Dhabi judicial system doesn't entertain much in the way of defence motions it considers frivolous and vexatious...

Index of Frank's Diaries
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 07:27:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Unless it strongly serves the interests of the ruling family.


"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Mon Dec 14th, 2020 at 04:07:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Possibly add Morocco, though that would depend on the Biden administration deciding to abide by Trump's recognition of Morocco's decades-old annexion of the former Spanish Sahara.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 07:26:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]
by Oui on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 08:27:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Polisario is entirely funded and armed by the Algerian regime, partly because of resentment for losing the 1963 border war with Morocco, partly because of a historical aspiration for access to the Atlantic (which, pragmatically, would be better served by having good relations with Morocco)

Morocco and Israel have always been in fairly close co-operation (they had diplomatic relations fron 1994 to 2000; Shimon Perez was Moroccan). Full recognition is not a big step, and does not entail a sell-out of Moroccan support for a two-state solution for Palestine.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 09:46:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
(Full disclosure : my in-laws are Moroccans of partly Jewish heritage)

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 10:40:22 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Rublyovka, suburb of Moscow. He will fit right in with the other retired despots, and there is a golf course nearby. Perfect place to stay while plotting his clever plan to return in 2024.

Plus lifetime presidential immunity, maybe, depending on the wording of the recent legal changes.

by asdf on Mon Dec 14th, 2020 at 12:15:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, at least for RUSSIAN ex-presidents.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Mon Dec 14th, 2020 at 03:53:52 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"the Dems aren't"

What did you think the House caucus was doing for the last 3.5 years?

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 03:08:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
But inciting followers to use of armed force to intimidate duly elected officals IS, and Trump has too many incendiary tweets and public statements that can be used to convict him. I hope he has a ticket to ride on the afternoon of Jan 20.


"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 10:10:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Doesn't POTUS have immunity from criminal lawsuits for anything they do during their mandate?
(Offer not valid after January 20, 2021, 12:00 PM EST)
by Bernard on Mon Dec 14th, 2020 at 03:50:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The DOJ has a fairly longstanding rule the Presidents cannot be indicted by DOJ while they are in office. It suppresses conflicts of loyalty, conveniently. The DOJ is SUPPOSED to uphold the law, not just the whims of the President. Hasn't worked out that way this time.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Mon Dec 14th, 2020 at 04:00:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I am afraid that if you are expecting Dems to grow a spine and realise they are re-fighting the civil war, you will be disappointed.

Index of Frank's Diaries
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 02:03:17 PM EST
Will some wise old man explain to the feuding parties the Blue States are the Democrats and NOT Abe Lincoln's Republican party. Tell the Confederacy if they have defeated the North, there will be a further campaign in the country of the gold rush: Eureka! The Demcrats have bred there too ... even have some gritty Marine and Navy stations.
by Oui on Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 03:27:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Sadly I must agree. This ugly precedent will NOT be properly challenged, if indeed it is challenged at all.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 10:11:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Let's remember that after the Civil War 63 Confederates served as Senators and many more as representatives. There was a raucous in 1866 over the seating of ex-Confederates in Congress which resulted in a commission to review the controversy. The former vice-president of the Confederacy, Alexander Stephens, was elected Senator in 1866 but was not allowed to serve. In 1873 he was elected as a representative and served several terms. After a devastating war that left 600,000 dead, treasonous individuals enjoyed the sanctity of Congress. This PR stunt by 126 charlatans might be best ignored so as not to give Trump followers a further reason to whine and play the self-righteous victim.

When Hephaestus triumphantly dragged his wife Aphrodite and her lover Ares, both snared in his gold net, before the gods, the gods quite rightly laughed at the cuckold's foolishness. Sometimes, being in the right has its inconveniences.

by de Gondi (publiobestia aaaatttthotmaildaughtusual) on Sat Dec 12th, 2020 at 10:59:04 PM EST
by Oui on Sun Dec 13th, 2020 at 06:50:38 PM EST
Given the incitement of violence against government officials and against citizens exercising their actual rights of voting and petitioning, and given Texas's threats to secede if its case did not succeed and its doubling down on that threat since last Friday, there is an issue here that needs resolved before those representatives are seated.  Apart from any sedition charges, there is the preliminary question of whether they can take their oath of office in good faith, since they have demonstrated their unwillingness to protect and uphold the Constitution.
by rifek on Thu Dec 17th, 2020 at 04:15:56 PM EST


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